The Sales Hacker Podcast
The Sales Hacker Podcast

Episode · 3 years ago

28. The Key Habits and Systems that Power High Growth SaaS Companies w/ Chris Degnan

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

We sat down with Chris Degnan, CRO of Snowflake Computing, one of the fastest growing SaaS businesses in the world, to learn how he went from being the first rep to leading the sales entire sales organization.

One two one twe three fo eighteen, it's the sales tacker podcastand your host Sam Jacobs, I'm the founder of the revenue collective. Westarted in New York. We've now got chapters in London and were launchingBoston, Toronto and Denver Pretty soon. So that's pretty exciting. I'm also thechief for EVENU officer of a company called BEHALOKS, but, most importantlyon the host of the show- and this is episode. Twenty nine we've got a greatshow today were interviewing Chris Degnan, who is the chief revenueofficer of snowflight computing snowflake and Chris Particularly, are agreat story about going from. Chris was actually the first sales hiher atsnowflake. They didn't heve e go to market model. They didn't have a go tomarket commercial strategy, Chris built that from the ground up theyare nowwell past a hundred million and they rr and one of the most successfulenterprise technology businesses to come out of Silkan valley and attractout of the US in a long long time, and Chris has an amazing approach to how wemanaged his career, how we sought out mentors how he laid the foundation sothat he could one day become a bep of sales and a CRO, and it's a fantasticconversation. Now one of the things we must do. We must do this. We have tothink our sponsors. We've got two sponsors this week and you probablyheard of them already. The first is air call air calls a phone call systemdesign for the modern sales team. They seemlessly seamlessly without seemsintegrate, intoour Seram, eliminating data entry for Eurypts and providingyou with greater visibility into your team's performance through advancedreporting. Now, when it's time to scale, what can you do? You know what you cando? You can add new lines in minutes and you can use incall coaching toreduce for amptime for your new reps visit ar called that Io forwardashsales hacker to see why Uber Don an Brad, sgreat pipe drive and thousandsof others trust aircall for their most critical sales conversations. Oursecond sponsor is outriached Adio, the leading sales engagement platform,outreach triples the productivity of sales teams and empowers them to drivepredictable and measurable Revenue Growth. That's interesting! Isn't itnow, what's more by prioritizing the right activities and scaleing customerengagement with intelligent automation that stupid automation, its intelligentautomation, outwhich, makes customer facing teams more effective andimproves his ibility into what really drives results. Hop over to outrage,odile force, las sales hacker to see thousands of customers, includingCloudera, glassdoor, Pandora and silo, rely on outrage to deliver higherrevenue for sales. Rap now give me two seconds. I want to point out some fansthat have written in one of the things if you're listening to this and you'rein the car. That's an honor, that's an honor for me to be sharing this carride with you, and I want to thank some of the folks that have reached outRobert Hanson specifically said that he's been driving around a lot and Ikept him company or sorry. I we, the sales acker podcast team, which is abig team of people, kept him company on his long drive. We also have outragefrom Scott Vanderlake Masha Ratovski, Trent Vander, stelt and Daniel Holnberg.So all of you thank so much for reaching out and the folks that havereached out and said, Hey, I drove from Chicago to Austin Texas and I listen tothe salls hacker podcast the whole way. Thank you. Thank you very much. We'vegot a bunch of great guests coming up and we've got a bunch of exciting newcontent ideas that were going to be testing. So thank you very much withoutfurther ado. Let us listen to Chris degnan CRO at snowflake computing, everybody, it's Sam Jacobs and welcometo the Sales Hacker podcast today were incredibly excited to have Chris Degnanon the show. Chris is the chief Revenue Officer of snowflake computing. He'sgot a long and story career in Silicon Valley, originally coming out to thevalley, one thousand nine hundred and ninety seven and winding up in SanFrancisco during the originalcom bum. His first big start was at EMC, wherehe spent eight years, both as a rep and a frontline sales manager. He then leftin two thousand and twelve, which will hereabout to join a company called aVexa that was acquired by EMC and eventually found his way in the summer.Two Thousand and thirteen to snowflaght,...

...computing and now snowflake is, I think,will find out, but well over a hundred million and run rihter is certainlyclose to that number and one of the fastest growing sast platforms of alltime. They've got over a thousand customers Chris Overseas, a salesorganization in the US Europe and the APEC region, and we're incrediblyexcited to have them so welcome Chris Texam glad to be here, yeah we're gladto have you. So we like to start off to just to frame people's experience incontext. You're Chris Dagnan near the CRO. It's noflaht computing give us aquick, thirty second elevator pitch on Snowflake who they are, what they do soat's Nof like we built a cloud database from scratch, and we started buildingthat in two thousand and twelve, our founders aure PhDs from from Oriklanand other major database companies, and we are native to the cloud we are onaws. We are on Microsoft, ager and we soon next year, Wi'll be on Googlecloud as well. In from a competitive landscape, we compete with Amaton,Google and Microsoft from a cloud data warehousing perspective and then onpremise, fenders or folks, like Terideta Oracle, IBM to Tisa thosetypes of folks that we compete with on the onpremise wold was I correct in therevenue range, give us rough Arr. Obviously private company confidential,but what's the range confidential, but what is it so we'lldo from a rat there's? Obviously, two numbers: There's ACD bookings is reallyMichael and there's revenue where usage based revenue system, so kind of uniquein that world will do well over a hundred million dollars in revenue andsomewhere in a hundred and fifty million dollars in these HV bookingsthis year, wow! Well, congratulations! That's incredible! And the company Ithink is raised. Am I reading this right? Four hundred and sixty threemillion dollars? Yes, four hundred sixty three million butterhill redpointaltimitor iconic, aqoamadrona wow. Okay, that's a lot of millions. Tell us aboutyou, sales org, so how many people? How do the function split out and walk usthrough that a little bit so we have a field sales organization. I think weoriginated. I was effectively sales rep number one an snow flake about fiveyears ago, and so we originated as a field selling organization and we'vegrown that to over a hundred and twenty field rups globally. Within my salesteam, we also have a corporate sales team, which is our inside sales team,which is about fifteen people and we're really starting to build that muscle ifyou will now. In addition, we have a BDR organization and we're roughly oneBDR to every three sales drups. That's our rough Racio nd. On top of that, Ihave the sales of Engineering Organization, which is a for every twosales rups, there's ONESC. So it's a two to one racio and then we have A. Ihave the alliance organization as well as the sales operations organiss. Thatis a large organization, and am I correct that you I mean you've beendoing startup, since so at least you've been doing software sales, regardlessof size, since one thousand nine hundred and ninety eight, so basicallyfor twenty years- yeah? Yes, that's correct, so you're old, just like my even going back coming, I talked to alot of people that graduated from you kN with law, degrees or journalismdegrees. How do you end up in sales in the first place and and how did thatjourney? Take you TA Snowflake Yeah. I think when I grew up in the Boston area,I think everyone I thought everyone made. You know money in finance andwhen I got out to the bay area, I got into a program at Franklin Templeton,which was a management training program and they rotate you through departmentsevery four months, and it was. It was a great experience and my first rotationwas through human resources, and I knew that was not a career path. For me Idid not like hr and then I went into the sales organization and I felt likeHey. This is something I like I like trying to sell something I enjoyed thepeople that I was talking to, but I didn't necessarily like the financeaspect of sales, and so that's when you know it was Acom Boom. I got involvedin startups and I kind of naviated my way to a company called covalentechnologies where it was my first real true enterprise, tech, sale and thenfrom there wegotten into EMC- and you...

...know, that's all Shero now, I'm overhere it Selfu and so emc sort of a big cu. You started off as a sales rep. isthat right and then walk us through that evolution? You became a manager,how you end up as the cro of such a huge company, it kind of lucky better lucky than good. As I always say.No, you know when I interviewed a MC. You know. I think this is probably oldschool, but I had a printed resume and I put on the printed resume. Myobjective was to be the vice president of sale someday, that's very true toform. I don't think I ever want to do anything other other than sell. I can'timagine being a CEO, I don't there's functions within the organization thatI never would want to manage, and so from that standpoint that was my highlevel objective and career objective and I kind of said what are the thingsthat I need to do to get there. So I knew that I had to be a successfulsales rap and I did that for four years and then I really pushed to be afrontline manager and got that frontline job at EDDIMC and I'll tellyou, man, EMC was a grind. It was a very tough organization to work at, butI learned a a lot and I call it effectively my MBA and sales at MC andthen, at the end of my time, ADMC I got sick of selling storage. I gotintroduced to the John mcman network, I'll call it vmmy. Branadamarens whoswas the xcro at OCTA and in sort of retirement right now and in that world.Being part of that, John mcman world opens up a lot of doors and I went to aVexi worked for a guy by the name of Andy Byron, another phenomenal salesleader in in my tenure out of Exa, probably the hardest sale of my career,but had a lot of fun. On my twelve month anniversary, we got bought by EMC,so being a back Intho Mc was not what I signed up for and even though I had toleave, you know shares that were worth a lot of money on the table. I kind oftook a neep of faith in jumping to snowlike back in twenty thirteen. Thereason I did it is there's a lot of sales leaders within the enterprisetech space that have the history of being successful they're, also in partof my French assules, and I made the decision after a lot of these companies.That came after me, being part of the John mackman network, offered a lot ofopportunities for me, and a lot of the opportunities came my way were eithersales leaders that I didn't care for, or just I couldn't get passionate aboutthe tack behind it and I got introduced by the to a Guy Byr. The name of MikeSpiser Mike is a founder in snowflake and a venture capitalist he's, alsofounder in pure storage and on their board as well to this day and Mike soldme on hey, make a decision that is, people based and market opportunitybased and that's effectively. Why I came to stuff like I joined snow plakinin two thousand and thirteen as a director of sales, I took a giant paiycut. I figured at this point in my career five years later. If I projectitout, I figured I would been fired and they would have hired a grey hairedsales leader to kind of be my boss, and I was fortunate enough to have BobMuglia our currency o come in. He came in after I did and he really bet on meand really pushed me and developed me, and I feel so fortunate to be part ofthat that that's an incredible story, and particularly well. First of all, Ithink, unfortunately, for both of US Chris. At this point we are the grayhaired people that that are going to do the replacing that's Nikt. That's sowhen you joind snowflake, I think it's. You know it was in Stealth Modon't. Now,if I as prerevenue, but it was certainly very early yourold customerzero, rebins Zere, not a single customer. So what do you do? How do youstart? How do you get going and sort of? What's like the playbook for the firsttwelve months when you're? In that stage I walked in, I think the firstday I said Holy Shit. What did I just do and then I said: okay, what are thethings that I've learned in my sales cor and I think going back to you knowmy time at EMC. I said all right. I'm going to hold myself. I had no managerlike Mike spiser was the acting CEO. He was in one day a week. I had a bunch ofengineers. There was literally, I was Ha Sixteenth, employee here at no flake,and there were fifteen engineers...

...staring at me and I said all right. I'mgoing to hold myself accountable to metrics and those metrics are soimportant to this day. So I ultimately said I need to have eight meetings aweek. That was my goal e customer meetings a week and then that's thehigh order bit and by the way, every Friday I had to write an email to theentire company summarizing all of the meetings I had. So I knew that therewas a shameful email coming on if I had zero meeting so that was kind of myself motivation and then I had to kind of back into how do I actually go andfind customers, because we were selfmilk? What I did was that initiallyI would go out and try to target the biggest companies in the planet,General Motors or something like that, and I realized that those companies arenot early adopters, not even close to earlier doctors, and so, after a fewconversations with large enterprisees. I really focused my time and effort oncompanies that were cloud friendly that had cloud native apps that were morecheap than anything. So I focused on Amazon really advertises theircustomers a lot. I hired an intern in between her and I we would build listsbased on people that were already in aws. I would go to job boards likeindeedcom and look for job postings of atlbs job postings, and then I would hve been going to linke in build a list from there and find the highest. Youknow the CTO, the CIO of that organization and send them an email,and my email was pretty simple- is hey. I run sales at a cloud. Dadawarehouseing company we've done something really unique where we builtfrom scratch. This sequal data warehouse where we've separated storage,drink compute and we natively injest semistructure data. I'd love, fifteenminutes of your time to just tell you what we're up to you and see. If youcould give me any advice on how we could actually make the product better,and that was really my. It was a soft sale and all of a sudden, I went frombanging my head against the while trying to go after the large enterpriseto getting inundated with opportunities after spanming thousands of peopleevery week, and I was cold calling people, and so I was up to my head andopportunities and that really led me to start building up the organization andgave the investors. Quite frankly, the will to allow me to Hihe people whenyou joined. Did you sign up for a revenue plan? Was it sort of, and itwas it like, a traditional ififty comp where half your commission is on closebusiness or was it much more emorphous because they didn't even know what thesale was at that point, and it's more like Chris well give you twenty percentof whatever you close until we figure out where the machine is and then oncewe build the machine we can set a target. I think that's the beauty of ofthese venture there's not a lot of Shi I inwe can get into later, but I'm nota huge fan of the venture capital community and there's, I think, a veryselect fo of really strong vcs, Mike spiser being one of them and Mike said,look you're not going to he sent my expectations. Woaquite frankly isyou're going to take a fifty percent pay cut for the next two years. By theway, can you do that now? He said the upside is in the equity, so bed on theaquity right and that's a typical venture capitalist. But I took that bedand I took a huge paycut and doing it and he said you're going to make yourown goals right and you're going to go and make the product better, and soultimately your job, the customers to use stuff like I don't care if they pay,I want them to actually use it and make the product better, and that was myhigh order bit and that's what I focused on. So I found customers and Ibegged them. It was probably the hardest sale of my career of convincinga customer to put their data in a product that basically didn't exist.That was really it, and so I goaled myself with getting customers in aboutnine months into my tenure. We signed up our first paying customer, and sothere was no commissions. It was a quarterly bonus and I basically made mymbos up and I shared them with the board and they agreed it every quarterand that's what I would do and the mbos would change quarter by quarter basedon where we were as a company. It makes sense, and so then the interestingthing about your experiencees first of all super recent right. Like it wasn't.Twenty years ago you were the first sales person, an noflake relativelyrecently and you've seen this medior...

Gros. So we can dive in and really getreally tactical details, which is awesome. So, first nine month you getyour first customer at some point, you start hiring. How do you figure out?Did you already have a playbook or a template, for you know how you're goingto build the or how many sales engineers you know the ratios you eretalking about bdrs to field. What was your game plan there? The first hire Ihad was, of course, an intern where she helped me build a themand generation,because I was my own demand generation machine and then I needed a salesengineer, because I was using our VP product marketing at that sales engier.So I needed that and then from there I was getting inundated where I did nothave enough time to actually tell the snowflake story, because there wasenough demand that I was generating where I needed more help. So I hiredtwo inside sils drups, who were still with us to this day and they've beenpromoted to the field a long time ago, and so I hided to e inside sales rups.They started to create more demand. The investor saw T, and so I had to go findthe three kind of core foundations of my sales organ. I hired two guys thathad worked for me in previous jobs and then one guy that I had to go find withthe help of my recruiter Chadpedes on helping get the core foundation of thesales team. So I started then, and where these three guys field guys,these were quote: ACAN field, guys, sales, sales leaders, they were leadersthat took individual contributor roles, so I convinced them. It was hard right,but I convinced them to bet on the company on me on everything, and that'sprobably the most important thing that I've learned in this entire process andwhat has enabled me to go from director of sales to chief revenue officer isrecruit people better than you and if you're able to do that, you will bereward. Absolutely recruiting top talent is probably the number one goalof a senior executive. So you added these three folks. These were salesleaders where they regionally focused. How did you organize them? Yeah I meaneffectively, yes, the short answers. Yes, they were resinally focused on aguy in the bay area had a guy up in Seattle and Seattle, and I a guy in NewYork and we kind of just divied up the country three ways between those threefolks and we kind of started going from there and then, as we saw demand in aspecific region, we would hire so the northeast was a hot bed for us, andthis Guy Vince trata, who works for me to this day is tince is based in NewYork. He was the first seals rap. We started to see demand not only in NewYork but in Boston, and then we so we hired a sales team up in Boston andboth an st and Sales Rop, and then we hired more people in the bay and soforth, and so on. So we would follow demand. I mean it was hey where a weseeing leads. Where can we not get to the opportunities and let's go hire asales team and then the demandis being created largely by you guys rightbecause maybe Ben he no by Marketing Work Aus there was we were inStealthmot, so there was literally, I had the BDR function and we wouldliterally build lists off of job boards off of as presentations. I wanted tofocus solely on companies that were in the cloud already and that were earlyadopters, and you can tell that you know. Small companies generally arecheap, they'll do anything if they like the technology and they can get it fornothing or next to nothing. They'll do that and those are our earliestcustomers ad tec customers, online gaming customers who had massive datachallenges and didn't have a lot of money. Those are her earliest customers,and so you know you guys are following demand. Obviously that I mean one ofthe things that is probably eminently clear, but we should articulate, asobviously you have a great product, because the demands going to dry uppretty quickly if a bunch of people are trying this thing out and not happywith it. So you've got something: That's working, you're scaling up theteam as your responsibilities grew and is, regardless of your title, as yourresponsibility shifted from being a sales manager to being a CRO. What doyou think are the main things that change what's different about the quote:Unquote: Cro Job from a regional head of the west coast sales, or somethinglike that? I think the biggest challenge that I've seen even withinpeople that within the organization that I've hired is there are some folksthat you hire that are good from like, like they say, the the venture capitalswill say: Hey, there's certain sales...

...leaders that are good from zero to tenmillion and then ten to fifty and then fifty to a hundred and so forth and soon. I think the thing that I'd say about it is: If you migro manage, ifyou were a micromanager, you do not have the ability to scale. So, as Isaid earlier, the key in my success here, its Nof Lake, is a yes, theproduct is world class and that founders are just amazing people, buton top of that, it's hiring great people and empowering those people tomake decisions on their own, helping them navigate those problems and that'sultimately, what I do even to this debt, for example, I hired a phenomenalleader in Europe, Tabo, Serelli and tipo was he was part of the originalteam in Europe and I'm not sitting there. Micromanaging Tebo, I'm allowingTobe to make decisions on where he's going to put people in Europe and howhe's going to grow the organization. Now I will give him guidance and I willhelp him get the resources he needs, but, but I'm not saying Tbo go to thissales called do this. Do that? No Man, you it's your business, you run it. Itrust you and you empower those people that you trust. That's basically whatmy whole philosthophy has been near at Snow Flake and I've been very fortunateto hire great leaders, my North American leader, the same thing so allgreat leaders, your articulating the tenants of great management so for thisGuy Tbo out in Europe. What you need from him is one of the things youprobably need is for him to tell you what resources he needs and then youneed to give him the goal or the direction. Here's where we're trying togo OES that sound right yeah. So the high order for us right is John mcmann.By the way at just a piece of advice I could give to anybody is when I madethe decision to joint snow like one of the things that I said to my spiser,who I think is amazing. I said Mike. I love you to death, I think you're, sopassion Abaut, what we're doing, but there's no one on the board. That caresabout sales, people and I'm working for you and the founders who are engineers.I need a sales leader like a person like John mcmann, on my board andLiterally Mike the next day, put John on our board, and so what I'd say aboutthat and what's key about that is John- has a model and it's a productivitymodel, and we followed that, and that was our revenue builds model and wesaid all right. Our goal is to get to a million dollars in ACV growth, Perrap,and so that's the model that we kind of built and that's how we decided on okay.I need this much head count. This will generate after six months. We expecttwenty five percent turnover and will generate after a rap has been here sixmonths. They will generate two hundred and fifty grands in ACV bookingsecorter, and that's my that's basically my unit of measure,especially early on, and so that's every region country, that we hiresales teams on the leaders held accountable to making ther reps,productive and productive is it was two hundred fifty Usan dollars a quarter,we're at a productivity number that's much higher than that. Now becausewe're seem such growth and do you factor in the cost I mean. Obviously,two hundred and fifty grand a quarter can be DOU factor on how much it'sgoing to take to get to two hundred and fifty grand quarter either in terms ofleads opportunities. BDR support is that all part of like the unit economicequation, there's a rate. Yes, there is a ratio for everybody, so there's forevery three field: raps there's one BDR for every two field: Reps there's onesales engineer and we have racios. So the numbers of sales ors drive the headcount for the entire company right, because that's all driving the milliondollar run raih after the Ram period dorrect. Yes, when you think aboutwhat's going to make you successful or not successful in your role, what doyou think the biggest determinantes are? What I've learned in meeting some bigcompany folks is, I think, a lot of big company folks and quite frankly, youknow I'm t starting to see it from my level now is I never had an assistant.Now I have an assistant. I have a sales operations team that builds my Bordecks. I used to have to build my board decks on my own, so you can get used tothat. It's like living t the life of luxury. If you will right and- and Ithink the thing that I've noticed is...

...when you hire big company people andthey don't have those resources available to them. Sometimes theystruggle. So from my advantage point it's kind of hilarious. In my view,point I get a lot of recruiters calling me and saying: Hey. We want someone,that's built a company from zero to a hundred million dollars in revenue andI'm like yeah, that's great but no offense to you, but I you know I'vedone that and I' probably don't want that job and I think, what's importantfor those people to realize is you want? My biggest thing is hiring potentialover like experience, I think potential and grind are probably the mostimportant thing. So I think the thing that you have to be willing to do atevery level at this company or any company is you need to get your handsdirty and a lot of it senior executives are unwilling to do that. You Know Hey.I give this big strategy, but I want a lot of people to execute. For me,that's not the way it is here and even our CEO Bob Mugly. I think that was mybiggest concern when Bob joined Bobom was the president of Microsoft of theservant tool, division of Microsoft. He worked for Steve Bommer, who was the CLMicrosoft and Sachinadella? Who is the Couo microsove used to work for mob andI think the unique quality that Bob has is someone who managed tenthousandfifteenthousand people bob gets his hands dirt and I think that's the keyis he will grind. He will go out on seales call, so he will go meet withcustomers. He will drive product to do stuff. He will get people, heunderstands the product better than anyone at this company. So I think whatI'd say is for those venture capitals that want tohire great sales leaders. I would say bet on the future, as opposed to youknow, hiring the experience. I think those people that grind and want thatVP sals job there's a lot of potential in those people and go find someonelike me five years ago. I think at those are the kind of the key qualitiesof people. You know that you're. Looking for how do you test for that?One of the things I've noticed at companies is early stage. Companiesoften they have guys like you or there's, often a couple early stars.The reason those early stars are there is because they didn't have a hiringprofile. They didn't have you know the score card and greenhouse. They werejust taking a bet on a few different people and a couple of them eemerged asmassive overachievers, huge grinders. We've got those people here at Behavox,the head of account management is, you know, a few years out of school, butthis guy will get on a plan, an fly anywhere in the world on a moment'snotice. His name's Nabile Ebrahim, so we've got those grinders, but fiveyears from now I'm going to have a speck and the speck is going to say. Ineed this much experience and this much experience doing this and this muchexperience doing that and what's going to happen, is that those kinds ofpeople are going to be screened out of the process because they're going to bedeemed to not have enough experience, and so some of that grinding upsideelement is going to be lost. How do I find the young grinders on their way up?That's a great question. I think it depends on what job you're hiring them,for I mean if you're hiring a BDR you're looking for qualities in thatBDR. So in any given interview, I don't care. If I'm hiring, you know we justhire to CFO right. I was part of that interview process if I'm hiring a BDRand I'm in the BDR interview. The first question I ask is tell me Your Lifestory tell me where you're from tell me that the reasons that you made thedecisions you made in terms of the college you chose tell me what you didwhile you're at college and what I'm looking for people that there'ssituations that they've actually had to work had to go rind in their careers.It might be hey, they were an athlete and they overachieved and they didxyanz in their. You know in their athletic career or they weren, theypaid their way through college, and then they got their first job and theyout of school and if you're, looking for a field, sals R up with potentialthe thing that I would say even to this day at snowflike, the number one thingthat I look for is within the last two years. You need to explain to me inyour job. You've actually opened up brand new logos for your company and ifyou have not done that, if you've been an account manager, you've managed oneaccount. That's not what I'm looking...

...for. Ninety nine percent of the time.Even to this day, where we're at from a scale perspective because we are inhypergrowth mot, so you need to find that great and grind and you're lookingfor that in their life experiences. So finding tough situations, you know, oneof the questions that John mcmian has got me asking candidates is give me thetoughest situation you've ever been in and I caviot it with. You can get makeit personal, professional bcause. Sometimes I've asked it just bant justgive me tougha situation, I've gotten some crazy, crazy responses, andsometimes I don't want those. So if GIV me to talk te situation that you'recomfortable talking to me about and that's ultimately, what I'm looking foris how did they? What is a tough situation? Have they grown up with asilver spoon in their mouth, or do they actually know how to grind those arethe things I'm looking for? What's the terrible answer to the question?Givming your toughest situation, I think it's like hey. I feel the test ordidn't get a job. I wanted or something like that, I'm looking for real lifeexperiences where they've said Hey. I was put in a situation, you know. Ijust interviewed a woman who explained to me a situation that she had a seniorleader in the organization, her effectively harassing her and shehandled it unbelievably and that's a really uncomfortable terrible situationfor for a young woman to be in and she handled it like unbelievably well as wewent through it- and I said man- Hey- that's super intarpropriate for thatguy to do that and be good for you for the way you handled it and an showed methat she's a pro and she handles it with grip and class, and I think thoseare the things you're looking for makes a lot of sense. They want to get alittle bit specific if you're willing to and just sort of talk a little bitabout your sales process. So you you guys use if I'm not mistaken, MEDIC ANDMED pick. So I don't know medpick walk us through that methodology. Well, somed pick is a variation of medic ind. The P is John Ngman implemented, ispaper process and there's an addedid see on the end, so there's two seas atthe end of medic. You know, instead of just having champion it's alsocompetition, so assume that a hundred percent of your deals are competitiveand if you don't assume that you're, basically wrong sales, raps put apordcast up and they say hey this customer Sol sourcing. SNOWFLAKE- and Isay you know Ds, that's not true, and by the way every seals call I go on. Itell the customer who our competitors are, because I am that confedent of ourproduct and the P is paper process, so paper Processin in a world where we'rea SASS company, where we house data that is painful. We have the typicalcustomer who's moving, especially a large enterprise whos early in theirprocess and moving to the cloud they put a lawyer on it or a proturment teamthat basically stifles innovation that I'm amazeat how some of these companiescontinue to innovate at a large scale, because these lawyers are are Stockin,I n th s and ultimately, what they focus on is hey. We want to be able tosue you for unlimited amounts of money in the event that you know you get hats.Well guess what we're in a world today where everyone gets tacked, a hundredpercent like hey, you know, by the way the US government gets hapked, were youknow the Russians just changed our elections, that kind of stuff, so we'renot taking unlimited liability and, by the way, no well run. SASS company willdo that period. Amazon doesn't do that. Microsoft doesn't do that. Googledoesn't do that and snowflike doesn't do that. So the paper process is a pain,because you have lawyers that, like basically draw a line and standand saywe will not cross that line. So I'd say that's my number one painpoint, butultimately the medic sales process is a way that we USOUR medpick is a way thatwe use to qualify the deal very consistently, and then you know this.Past year, we kind of implemented at my sales kick off in February this pastyear we did a training from a company called Force Management Consulting, andwe did force management training, which...

...is just you know, value base, sellingon top of medic or Medpick, and those are the things that we focus on. Sowe're focused on not just selling a commodity. Hey snolflake can runqueries really fast, that's a commodity. What are the kind of the value driversof snowflike that they business users will get even though it's a technicalproduct? So we try to take a technical product and show business value in itto the customer and make sure that the customer understands hey. This is thesuccess criteria and, by the way, you as a Sallesrap, need to make sure thatthe customer is on the same page as you on the success criteria and if thesuccess criteria changes and it changes in a way that we don't like it, youshould pull out of that proof of concept and being able to pull out of aproof of concept. What gives you the courage to do? That is pipepine, so itall starts with generating strong pipewine. If you do not have a strong,pipeine you're going to grabold, do it del you're going to hug it you're goingto love it, and even though the deal from a medic standpoint doesn't hold upto the qualification and ultimately you're going to fail as a salesperson,so fiplin generations what we focus on and that's what to this day, I hold mysales leadership to is making sure they generate that and HEU have metricsaround that and then on the medic side of things you kind of do opportunity,reviews with the customers with the sales reps at any given time. Thank youfor that level of detail. Let's talk about quotas really quickly. There's alot of enterprise sellers out there tellsus about as much detail as you cangive about your cop plans like what percentage you're paying where theaccelerators kick and things like that always useful information. So I'll justyou know, I won't give you the exact you know on target earnings, but ingeneral, when I first started the first year that I started hiring sales people,we had no real revenue to speak of. We gave raps, basically eight hundred andfiftythousand OAR ACV growth quota. Today we have reps with a million and ahalf dollar ACV growth quota, and you know we have reps that are killing thatwe had a rep that did a seven million dollars and growth on a million, a halfdollar azv quota quota. So you can imagine that my sales team is prettyhappy on the amount of money they're making. In fact, over, eighty percentof our sales team is actually forecasting to be over their quota.This year, H ch, which is exciting, that's Fante and it's an annual quota.Is that right? I don't believe in anything but anual quotas. In fact, Biinterviewd, a CFOL Kennidyt. We suggested we should go to half yearquotas and no surprise. I was a fumbs down an lhet's C. If Ol cin that you are, you are a function ofbeing an enterprise sallards. I think it sort of depends probably on themarket segment yeah I mean you know. I have a friend at docty sin WHO's on.You know they're on monthly, recurring, rabbiting Woll! That's not! If you want someone to do that. That'snot me right! That's what I'll say is. I'm focused on large enterprize sound,not just large, I'm mid market to large enterprise but field salesorganizations. That's ultimately what up you know. My expertise is and then,when I don't have that muscle built, I go higher leaders in that space andthat muscle is, for me, is a guy by the name of Mark Wendeling who's, my vicepresident corporate sales. So one lits question about complents, so annualquota, whatever it is million and a half bucks, I don't know Whit's seventypercent, a million and a half Buckes, but is there a it's around a millionbelow? Is there a point at which you don't pay anything at all thatit's? MyQuestion Yeah? If you don't close it, it is there like a breakpoint, sometimessome folks, it's just controversial topic where, like past, if you're underfifty percent attainment of your quota, you don't get anything at all. I'm nota fan of that O. I'm not that I mean look our sales motion. Is You know ahundred percent of our customers evaluates nowflike. In fact, you knowafter this call, you can get on our website and sign up for snowflike viacredit card, so a hundred percent of our customers evaluate snowlike beforethey buy it. Now, whether it's an about free evaluation that we control or it'sa paid evaluation that they control those are up to them, but ultimatelythe sales raps and the way that the...

...biggest difference in Sass versus likewhere I sold you know. Hardware device at at EMC is there's almost immediategratification in the hardware world is hey, I can go sell a you know, do aproofol concept and at the end of that proof of concept, I can get a fivemillion dollar deal well with snowflake because we're a usage base system, thesales are past to go and do a land deal. First, Hey, let's go find a usecase, solet's go do twentythousand dollar deal first or fifty Thouzan dolar deal firstand that customer will get that usecase going and then we'll upsell them intoadditional usecases. That is our model. That's how we work and it's to thebenefit of the customer. We actually only revenue based on usage, socustomer actually has to see value in snowf like for them to use it and forus to ultimately get paid. So our seals team, what I quote of them on is ACBbookings and growth, so they have a renewalce quota and a bookings quota, R,O growth quota, and so they get one rate for the ACV for the renewal andanother rate for growth. And that's what I that's. What I have them focusedon and then there's in that sense, they're both hunters and farmers,because he's Otin now, but you got to expand and they have a gat to get to the accelerators and the gate is theyhave to open up a minimum of four new logos in a given year, based on theirterrictor anywhere from four TA logos and Givini love it Chris? This has beenan amazing conversation. Just a few last questions for you, the main one isyou know we like to pay it forward. We like to figure out who are they there'stwo types of pay it forward questions one is: Who are the people that haveinfluenced you and the names that we should know that have been inspirationsand mentors and the second is hote of the pieces of contents. So what are thebooks that you've read or the methodologies that have transformed orhelped you evolve? Your sales perspective in my career there's been some prettykey folks on the sales side, I workd for a guy, the name of Jim Cavana atEMC. He was a ballbuster and he's now, president of Asia. Pack for aptynamics,I don't know that I could work for Jim again. I love him to death, but I don'tknow I could do that, but he taught me a lot. You know a lot of Yo now basicblocking and tackling. I think, John mcmann, from a sales leadershipperspective. He's really helped. He's been really an advisor to me through myentire process here at snowflake of building the Sales Organization and I'mvery fortunate that he's been on our board, so he's amazing amazing, Mikespiser from Cetter Hill again, one of those guys that bet on me in a big wayand ultimately Bob Muglia, our CEO, who our board said: Hey, go hire a quote.Unquote. As I said earlier, Greyhaire experienced sales leader and he said no,I'm Chris is my guy because look at this organization that he's built. Sothose are some of the key folks and then I've been very fortunate to have arecruiter by my side, the entire time at snowflake by the name of Chadpeteshe's a partner over at Ceter Hill. I in fact he was not prior to. I actuallyintroduced him to Setter Hill, so I will take some credit instead orgetting chat over there. So Cha's been a critical business partner for me andthen there's just you know it's important for you to network with othersales leaders. So you know, like I said earlier, Adam Arin SMOCKTA. He didn'tOwmy ad anything other than being a nice guy, and I would always ask himhow he would handle ha situation. Andy Byron. You know the guy who runs salesover at cyberies an now an next boss of mine and- and he again was very kindwith his time in terms of coaching me and helping me, so I think gettingcoaching from peers. A D that sometimes aren't involved within yourorganization is Super Healthul as well perfect, any books, anything you thinkwe should rite yeah. So so right now, I'm one of those people that basicallytrust nobody, and so this book caught my eye. Most recently of everybody liesand it's a big databook and ultimately I didn't know this. There's a thingcalled Google trends and you can go into Google trend and see what'strending and what you find is the Internet is the ultimate source oftruth, and you might not tell your friends what you look t on the Internet,but the Internet knows and Google knows, which is a little bit scary, but butlearning about that. So it's a big databook about you know how people lie,what they lie about and that kind of...

...stuff. So to me, that's probably themost important thing for me right now, love it any lastwords life mottos,guiding principles. There's you know a young twenty two year old listening tothis right now and you have a chance to shape his or her mind. What are yougoing to talk? Ig I mean I in fact I just know I just did a speech, TOR orBTR team. Yesterday. Look, I hate entitlement first of all like if you'rea senior executive and you feel entitled to Success If you're a twentytwo year old, who's, gotten trophies for winning nothing, your whole life.You have to come and earn everything that you do so nothing comes easy if itdoes it's probably too good to be true, be humble- and I think that's importantfor my team now is we've seen success and I don't I want to be clear. I haveno arrogance about the success. I have I'm on a three month: contract everyquarter. That's how I view it and I have to live up to my three monthcontract and I have to hit my quota and H and that's that's how I run mybusiness and that's how I run my life. I do think long term, but I think Benghumble grind yourself, don't expect people to do anything. You wouldn't doyourself and ultimately, don't be an assole because look it's a small worldpeople will hear about how you treat people in the future and, although youmight be at a good company today, thatall eventually end and you wantanother good job in the future. And people do blind references on you so behonest, be transparent, don't be an asshole and and go get it. I love itChris thanks. So much for your time, it's been a great pleasure chattingwith you awesom saying thanks for your time. I rea appreciate the time: Hey folks, it's Sam Jacobs. This isSAMs corner another fantastic interview with Chris degnon from snowflakecomputing. You can hear the passion coming through Chris's Voice. He soundslike an awesome guy to work with and an inspiring manager and leader. So I lovethe conversation, one quick tobit that you can pull out from Chris, justenterprise sale, so Chris believes and annual quotas and one and a halfmillion dollar quota right now at snowflake and the pay it out annuallyand you can imagine it's probably like a F. fifty split and thit's, probablytenx that one point: five million is probably ten times the base salary ofmost enterprise raps and I'm sure it varies. But there's a debate around.What's The cadence of the quota and my perspective on it is that it shouldmatch the sale cycle so for SNB and mid market, probably monthly for us and B,certainly maybe for midmarket. That's a y day sale cycle, probably quarterlyand then for longer enterprise sales that are nine to twelve months inlength. It's twelve months also note that Chris is sales people, thefieldsales people. They have a ACV growth target, which means essentiallythat they land an account and then they expand ID over time, and so that is howtheir team is organized. I woild also say that the life lesson that Christries to impart is be a grinder just go in there, get your hands dirty, do thework and be humble about it and you'll rise to great heights. So that is yourSam's corner for today now we always want to think our sponsors. So let'smake sure that we do that Theyar call your advanced call center software,complete business phone and context center, one hundred percent nativelyintegrated into any SRM and outreach a customer engagement platform that helpsefficiently and effectively engaged prospects to drive more pipeline andclose more deals. I'llse you next time and thanks for listening.

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