The Sales Hacker Podcast
The Sales Hacker Podcast

Episode · 2 years ago

36: How to Market to Developers w/ Meghan Gill, VP Sales Operations, MongoDB

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

This week on the Sales Hacker podcast, we interview Meghan Gill, VP of Sales Operations at MongoDB.  

Meghan has been at Mongo almost 9 years and was the first non-technical hire at the company, helping them scale past an IPO in 2017 and transitioning from an early career in Marketing into Sales Operations.  

One two one twe three FO everybody: This is Sam Jacobs. I am thefounder of the revenue quective and I'm the chief revinue officer of a companycalled behavoxer listening to the Sales Hacker podcast today on the show, we'vegot the VF of sales operations, Megan Gil at Mungo, DV, Mungo IPO last yearin October of w thousand and seventeen and Megan was the first non technicalhirer at the company. They now have a sales team of ow over two hundredpeople and revenue of over two hundred million and their public company. Soit's a great conversation. She started off in marketing and then moved intosales, as a consequence has really deep insights into highly technicalenterprise sales that are sort of bottoms up. They call him smoke Hamoutmarketing strategies where they market first at the individual developer andthen from there they pursue and push up into the enterprise, and so it's areally interesting conversation they've had tremendous success and we'reexcited to have round the show. Now before we get to the show. We want tothank our sponsors. The first desere call a phone system designed for themodern sales team air call seamlessly into great sentoer Crm, eliminatingdata entry for your repts and providing you with greater visibility into yourteams performance through advance reporting. So when you're ready toscale, you can have mew line and minutes t and you can use in callcoaching to reduce Ramtime for Youo rups they've got a new product focusedon sales. They originally started in customer success and they're doinggreat work and they've got a great Atam Marketing. Jeffre kers WHO's been on.This show so visit air called O io forward sash sales hacker that is hair,called Aut iole forward sash sales tacker to see why were done in BradStreet pipe drive, thousands of others trust air call for the most criticalsales conversations. Our second sponsor is outreached. A Ao Alridge is also asponsor of the revenue collective which we're super excited about O reaches theleading sales engagement platforms, so they triple the productivity of salesteams and empower them to drive predictable and measurable revenuegrowth by prioritizing the right activities and scaling. Customrengagement with intelligent automation, outreach makes customer facing teamesmore effective and improves isability into what really drives for Sults,which they will tell you that I suppose hop over the our reach. Ot Il forashsales hacker to see how thousands of customers, including clouder glass door,pandor and zoo, rely on our rage to bulver higher revenue for sales rap. Sothat's outridched. I io forward LSH sales tacker and without further ADO.Let's listen to Megan Gill from Mongo PB everybody at Sam Jacob's. Welcome tothe saleshacker podcast were incredibly excited to have Megan Gil on the show.Today, Megan is VP of sales operations at Mongo DB. Importantly, she wasemployee number eight at the company and has been with the company almostnine years and has watched that company grow from a very really stage whichwe'll hear about all the way through IPO. She started off in marketing andthen recently moved over into sales operations. Recently about a year and ahalf ago, I guess she's also an adviser to a lot of early stage companies herein New York and an advisor to flybridge capital, which is a VC FOCUSD on ourestage investments, so she's a well known, start, UF adviser, in additionto being a really respected sales and marketing leader here in the New Yorkcommunity. So Megan welcome to the show, thanks for having me, we are excited tohave you. So one of the things that we like to do right at the beginning issort of understand a little bit about your background and, as we say, getyour baseball card. So you know your name is Mega Gill, your VPF salesoperations. We know that Mongo DB's a public company. We know that it's a BigNew York success story, Tbat a lot of people, don't know what Mongo Depe doesso give us the quick overview of the company that you've been with for closeto nine years. Sure so MONTB is a we nake database technology, so we make amore flexible and scalable database solution that makes developers moreproductive. That's it in an asshel good and then so. What's rough revenue range,I'm in your public company, so I guess we could look it up on your most recentfiling, but what's the run rate of the...

...business, you coan say roughly twohundred million and growing going in a pretty fast clip, that's exciting, andso you guys ipoed in basically very recent what it was it was it a fewmonths ago was it a year ago it was a year ago, so we had our one year as apublic company anniversary. I want to say two weeks ago as of this recording,so we're recording in October two thousand and eighteen. So we wentpublican October, two thousand and seventeen. Congratulations so tell usabout your story, a little bit where you from you know. What's yourbackground, how did you end up at Mongo back in in two thousand and nine sure?So when I toined Mygoa to be at the end of two thousand and nine we were, I wasthe Aith employee. It was all engineers and how I got there is. I knew thefounder Eliot. We went to to college together and I was looking to join astartup, and so I went to ela for advice thinking. He would refer mesomewhere. I didn't expect him to say: Hey whynt, I you join MONGDB because Iknew very little about open source software. It was a very technicaltechnical product. There was no sales and marketing team, but he said heyyou're, smart. Why don't you join? You can come and just help us get leverage,help us figure things out and that's pretty much exactly what I did. I had avery sort of moldifaciting role when I joined and over time I became morefocused on marketing and particularly developer marketing, and then over theyears I ended up running multiple teams, Iran, developer relations. I ran to mangeneration, I ran events and then about a year and a half ago the CEO and thecro asked me to take on sales operations and again I was like, I knownothing, sort of similar when I joined mom to me. I was like I don't knowanything about sales ops. I know I'm fairly analytical from having run toman generation and they kind of gave me the same Sfiel they were like well.This is a great opportunity for up. You know for you, because you'll learn alot about how the sales organization is run and it's good for us, because youknow the company, you know the business, you know all t the people and the nuances of howthings what things work on, what things don't work and think coul be a good fitfor it. So that's how I ended up in this role. So how do you define salesoperations at Mongo DB? What is the scope and sweep of yourresponsibilities? Sure? So my role is the it's a bit of it can be a bit of aCatchal and- and actually it's funny- because I was thinking about this as asproparly this podcast- that one of the things that was great about the earlydays ofbogeob is that whenever there was a problem that wasn't engineeringrelated, I just had to go figure out how to fix it. Then it drove this sortof high degree of accountability and problem solving and I think that's sortof the same concept in sales. Opfs is that you know whatever certainy needsto get fixed, it's my job to fix it, but the scope F. my role is really e:The systems, the reporting and the analytics to support the sales team andto get the highest productivity out of the sales team. We possibly can that's.My mandate tell us about the sales team, because it's sort of it's got a lot ofdifferent pieces in it, particularly given such a complex sale sure. So, ata high level, we divide our sales team into two main segments. We have acorporate segment which is calling on companies with today, with less thanseven hundred fifty million in revenue next fiscal year. We're going to makesome changes which I can talk about, and then we have an enterpriseorganization which calls on seven hundred fifty million plus and they'reout in the field they're organized geographically. So we want to optimize,for you know, reps an Dallas calling on the customers in Dallas and so forth,and then we have some supporting functions. We have a solutions,architect, organization, which is our technical, Presales r organization thatsupports the sales raps, as well as a pertnal organization that helps us soresteels through strategic usiyes and isvs, and help us sort of go to marketwith those companies and would tell us this Os. This is, you know all very,very interesting Pertiuar for myself going that I run a growing enterprisesale, the tily technical. So some of these questions might be veryselfinterested but ogiven. What is the ratio of o solution?Architects, which it might incorrect...

...and saying that that's largely salesengineers, that's sort of what most people would call them? What's theratio between them and the field sales teams, and when we think about a citylike Dallas or a city like, I don't know Los Angeles, how many people, howmany sellers are in those markets or is it purely driven by this? Is Theterritory theres? So many people there are sure Solansa. The first questionabout ratios: First, so we actually run in slightly different ratios for acorporate versus our enterprise team. So our enterprise team, you know we'reexpecting the reps to be traveling to be on site. So we expect to haveroughly in a steady state three to one. The reality is it ends up being morelike two or two and a half to one, because we're growing so fast. So as anexample, we just put our first sales rep in Korea, so we can't put a salesrap without us without an essay, so we have a one to one ratio there and wesort of build that into our planning is like you know. We know that certainratio, certain territories as we grow them, were going to have more essays tomatch the number you know the as we put in the first reps in those areas, ourinside team. It's a slightly! You know it's a little bit more, it's moretransactional. The reps are on the selling on the phone, so it's typicallymore like a five or six to one ratio, but we're sort of we've also beenexperimenting with with that ratio as well. I guess the one of the questionsI have is: how difficult is it to recruit essays solution, architects andwhat's the level of technical experience that you require orexpertise or substance, that you were that you expect from the sellerthemselves soar as a debate. You know in these highly technical organizationswhat what is the expectation of sales? Do you guys have a clear definition ofwhat the salesperson is supposed to do and how that is different from what thesolution architect is supposed to do. I think it is quite different. I mean youknow our sales raps are one of the their key responsibilities. That'squite distinct from an SSA is pipeline generation. Right I mean that's like ahuge part of the job. Now I think, if they're technical, they're, going topotentially the sales rep, has some technical background. They culd putpotentially do a better job, AF PG, because they understand the audienceand they understand what the person cares about. We did do some analysisrecently about people's backgrounds and try to correlate you know are that theare the rips with more technical background, more productive than repswithout a technical background, and we found that yes in Generalltye are, butit wasn't hugely significant and they do work closely with the essays oncethey do get into a deal in terms of sizing and scoping and defining therequirements interesting. It's always been difficultfor us, at least to find essays to find people that are technical in all ofthese different markets. Do you guys sort of experience the same thing,which is that it's sort of more difficult to find the technical salesengineering solution, architecture support in some of these markets as itis to find great sellers, or is it just finding great talent as Hard Tho matter?wher Yo, I would say just finding great talent is, I mean I'd, say theinteresting thing are. I think our biggest challenge challenges. It's notmarket size, because the database market is huge. It's like forty billiondollars a year growing and I think the product is great. Our biggestlimitation has been finding talent in engineering at sales essays and allfunctions to grow at the rate that we want to grow yeah. Well, I think that'sa common situation for a lot of high growth companies. You guys are you knowit's a hundred and it's a large organization. You started as the firstnon technical hire walk us through some of the phases of growth, because Ithink you know you mentioned. There have been some sort of shifts, and Idon't know if they're called pivots, but certainly thereave been inflectionpoints in the growth of Mongo DB. Give us a little bit of that experience. Asit's been over nine years. Sure I mean when I joined. We had no sales Raa, weprobably hired our first, they aren't our first sales or, but Iwant to say like six or twelve months after I joined and those raps werereally very reactive. I mean we had a pretty. I mean I was running runningmarketing program. So to my own horn, I...

...thought we were doing a pretty good joband marketing. We had a lot of inbound demand, and so they were reallymanaging that that inbound demand and we overtime, built the salesorganization, and we did split it between an inside organization and afield organization and one of the early iterations they were. Actually youcould consider them kind of overlay, so they were covering the same accounts,but they were split based on the size of the deal, and I actually thoughtthat that was a pretty, not optial configuration, because people would dofunny business to make sure the deal was on. You know I forget what thethreshold is like. Let's say it was a FFIFTYK threshold and inside wasclosing less than that, and outside was closing deals bigger than that, as thatcreated situations where people were trying to hang on to deals or move orchange the size of the Oso that they could close it. So then we changed theconfiguration of the sales organization to be based on revenue, so our insideteam was was had sole responsibility for companies less than a certainrevenue threshold, and the outside team was closing deals above that thresholdand over time we kept raising the revenue threshold, and then we sawsomething else happen which I alluded to earlier, which is that, even thoughour threshold got all the way as high as seven hundred an fifty million inrevenue, our inside team has had the most success with companies with lessthan a hundred million in revenue, so we're actually doing something counterintuitiv, we're saying hey. We want you to focus on where you're having successwhen they're having a lot of success are actually quite productivelthyinside team. Let's focus you on on the low end on accounts Luss, a hundredmillion. Does it mean that you're the the GV team? It just means that youfound your. You found your sweet spot and let's give the enterprise team achance to go after the account said. You know basically you're not focusedon you're, not spending enough time on. Let's give the enterprise hemacrack atthose, so I've seen sor of multiple iterations and different ways ofstructure the team- and you know, even though wour public company were stillliterating on it. Yeah. I'm sure- and you know, you're known in many ways Imean I guess for most of the time at at Mongo, you were doing marketing and youguys have an interesting go to market model because it's sort of developerdriven so walk us through. You know that, because you know you mentionedyou're working on demand generation like welcome Tou the model for howMongo DB identifies an opportunity and how you became good at figuring out howto market to developers sure. So our approach has been to have to create,like a really amazing customer experience and an amazing experiencefor developers. SOMOGABE is open source and we treat open source almost like afreemium model, so you can get up and running and try mogaty be and buildapplications ATMONGTB, either with our open source version. And now we have acloud product called Longa to be atlas where there's a free tear or so youcoan. You know very quickly get up and running with the product and that's howwe generate demand, because we make it really easy to for developers to useand the way we think about sales is the sales. Reps are really looking for whatcalled smoke as in when their smoke their fire. So they're looking foraccounts where there's activity could be. You know, developers just tinkeringaround and they're going and talking to those developers fiding out what kindof projects there are and then pillaring up to a decision maker orsomebody more senior to talk about a more strategic morsataged deal. What is the benefit of going from sortof free open source to Payn? Is it security and sort of some of the InfoSec and some of the things that an enterprise cares about, or there aredifferent features sure so, there's really two routes. You can go in termsof paying for MONTB there if you're running on prem you're, probably goingto have security requirements, you're going to have operational requirements,so we offer an onprim product call of Bong go to be. Enterprise advanced,which includes advanced security, includes a tool called ops manager. Thlets you, you know, manage and run MON, be no within your data center and then,if you want to go to the cloud we offer to a called Monga. The Atlas, which hasa Free Tier, the Nice thing. Bot Atlas is that it, you know, automates andhandles all of a lot of the operational things that a a technical team or anoperations team we need to do in order,...

...run order, run MOL to be on their ownand it's integrated with aws Google cloud and with Azure. So you can. TheNice thing is is that you can run in on any cloud that you want and you haveflexibility to be o. You know multiple clouds. What are your key insihes from you know,running developer marketing for so long and from running to man. Gen Get us inthe heads the minds of the developers and what are some of like the greatmarketing programs that you run just really curious, because you didn'tformarly have a marketing background, but you spent a lot of time. I wouldimagine putting yourself in the mind of either a decision maker or sort of anengineering manager or a developer themselves. What was that like and whatare some of the key onsits that you drew. I think the key inside is, youknow, developers they don't really like being quoteuquote marketed to, but they are really hungry for information and for learningit for education. So we took that angle in pretty much all of the marketingprograms that we did so as an example, one of the early successes was doingthese one day developer conferences, which we still do the early ones. Imean I'd, probably be embarrassed to like look. You know if I were runningthat evit now probably be embarrassed as it was like the production value wasso low and was so minimally branded. But it didn't matter because peoplewere there to learn. They were there to figure out how they could solve theirproblems with MOTB, how they could build applications more efficiently.That was like an early marketing win and then you know another keymarketinitiative, which is still really an important part of our go to market. IsOur Amon oing to be university, so we offer free online courses where you canlearn MON MINYB and we've had t over a million people register for a course tolearn mon at to be so again. It's like to me, I think, about, like theEducational Angle, has been really effective for working with developers.What is the narrative that you've constructed given again? Like manypeople? I don't think you majored any market, angrory and Yo didn't major insales, certainly because that's nearly impossible to do so. What's thenarrative or how do you think about approaching career development, aprofessional development for yourself and sort of advice that you might givetwo other folks that are out there listening sure? So if anybody's readLenan, which I know is Sheryl sambers book is really thought about, mostpeople, think of it as being about purely about women, but I think there'sa lot of really great generic career advice in it and one of the reallygreat pieces of advice she she gives him the books to think of your careeras a Jumgle Jym, rather than thinkg about it as a ladder. So, in my caseyou know I could have just kept going up the ladder and learning more moreabout marketing, but I actually decided to take a a step to the side and workon sales off. To give me a broader perspective. Similarly, like you know,I think a lot of people get really poned in on things like titles like.What's the role? Am I going to be LP, marketing or Vpssales? My perspectiveis better to be in a company who cares about the title and Caurs of the roleif you're in to company this growing really quickly, there will always benew opportunities if you're doing a good job in your any value, which isthe experience I had have had a chance to do multiple things within marketingand now within within sales. So I would say that the topies is an advice. Areyou know, thinkinf? That is a jumble gym, not a ladder and, secondly, tothink about joining a great company is so much more important than the thespecific job title or job description. was there a point at Mongo DB when itbecame clear it was going to be this IPO opportunity? Is there something youattribute that success to, or is it really just fundamentally, you built agreat product and you guys just continue to iterate and figure out howto surve you customers better. Well, that's an interesting question. I meanyou know, I think every I think most people when they were joining a startupor hoping for a great altco like in like an IPO. I think for us, yes,product was there stronggo to market and then also just the size and thespip of the market. I mean we think we're only capturing a very smallpercentage of the old world database market which jist you know over founbillion. So if we keep executing, then we can gettinue to grow at the thepiece that we're throwing it's a great outcome. Socongratulations on it. You know one of...

...the things that we were sort of talkingabout before and that you mentioned in in a note to me as talking about movingfrom final framework, which I guess Brian Hallegan at sub spot wasmentioning to a flywheel and how companies need to focus on customerdelight. Are you guys doing that at mango dv walk us through how you'rethinking of it, which is often, I guess, it's sort of like a marketing framework,but probably also relevant to the sales organization yeah? So I just recentlywatched Brian Hallegan's Henote at inbound Wan. He talks about going fromfunnel to fly wheel, and I think this is IU. A really indicative of how themarket is changing. You know I mean it used to be that the person who had allthe information and it held all the cars was the sales rapp they had. Theyknew everything about the product about the market, about the competition. Nowit's a lot easier for people to get that kind of information on their ownand it does put sales at a bit of a disadvantage, and it means that youknow what's become the the most powerful form of sales and marketing.Is Customers wore talking about the experience they're having with yourproduct and generating vorality? So I think that means that as sales peopleand as marketers, we need to reorient towards creating an amazing, positivecustomer experience so that our customers will refer people- and youknow, talk about the great experience that they're having so that canmanifest itself in many ways like you know, one way, for example, was havinga really strong customer success organization. That's integrated withyour sales organization, which is something that we have anotherapproachis. You know we have all of you know some companies once a deal isclosed. They passe the renewal off to a renewals to we have our sales repscontinue to own the relationship and kown the renewals, which means thatthey're really invested in the the success of the customer and thinkingabout making sure that theyre they're going to renew when that, when thattime comes so there's different ways that you can integrate it into the comthat concept into the company yeah. Do you find that the sales people do theyembrace that idea of maintaining the relationship? Are there tradeoffs thatyou have with the customer success or Account Management Teams in terms ofdivisional responsibilities? It's always an interesting challenge. Tothink about. To what extent they cs or am teams are motivated by specificrevenue, gapis versus the sale sem? How do you guys structure this s? I'm astrong ten believer that the at least in a business like hours that the repsneed to own the renewals and the reason for that is that we're a land andexpand sales votion? So, if you think about how many database applications asingle company could have, I mean the first deal? Is just your foot in thedoor, so it would not make sense to pass that on to somebody who's more ofa a farmer to maintain the relationship. We want the raps to stay, engage andstructure the complents than structure their territorys, so that they'rereally motivated to stay gauge in the with the customers. Now I agree, theyrea tradeoffs like doing a renewal like that takes away time from generatingnew business and it takes away time from you know, getting new logos, but Ithink that it's important enough an a land and expand that we're willing tomake that trade off, and I think it's the right thing to do when you thinkabout you're in sales, ops now and to the point of land and expand and sortof like looking at the sales team and looking at the sales motion. There's alot of enterprise sellers out there and you're in this unique role, becauseyou're in sort of the opps functions so you're, looking at at the productivityof all of the different sellers and sort of what makes success and whatdoesn't. And you said that you've done some analysis trying to determine iftechnical background or some level of technical knowledge helps peopleperform better. What are the other insights that you've gleaned looking atsort of sellers from this andalytical objective perspective, in terms of whatmakes a great seller who your most successful people are? And why- and youknow what lessons can you share with the audience sure I can share? I meanone sort of counter intuitive insight we HAV had, and this has less to dowith the people in the profile is around focus. I think we're big fans offocus at Monggtb, so we did an analysis to figure out. Okay, I think ittuitivelyo would think. If I give someone a bigger patch and moreopportunity, they're going to be more...

...productive, we actually found prettymuch exactly the opposite that the fewer accounts somebody has the morepro productive they are, and it actually makes sense to focus people ona handful of really good accounts where they can get deep and they can maybesay, qualify I'll quickly or qualify in quickly. That was one insight that wehad and that had US move our entire sales organization, including ourinside raps, to a named account bottle when you say a handful like how is itfive inutes on he role, and this is the other sort of key an site? Is You know you can't treat every person?You know every person's unique right. You have to match the player to theposition right, so an inside rep can handle. You know. Seventy five accounts.It's very high velocity they're qualifying in and out very quickly. Youknow our enterprise team, you know they're more focused on you know,fifteen or twenty accounts n in even twenty could be a lot of accounts forthem to have Anto handle an they start, getting really deep in them. You knowour most one of our most most productive, reps, he's down to threeaccounts and he's just really focused on on expanding within those accounts,now they're, very large organization. So that's there's room to expand himwith within those those three accounts, but it has to do with the person andther their skill set and sort of matching the territory in the accountsto their abilities. How early did you guys go, feel and did you struggle andor how did you address the struggle of a growing company? You know venturebact with all of these people that are hiring that don't work in the officeand sort of imbeling them with the Mongo DV culture. At the same time thatyou know I've got a hundred and fifty people around the world. You GotSomebody in Korea different time zones. How do you guys address that challengeof sort of cultural scaling with field sales, people and people that don'twork in homebase? It's not easy for sure. We do bring people together forqbrs centrally I mean wwe bring all of the sales leaders together. We have onein Europe and one in North America, where they're with the HEADOF saleshonofr some of our board members or CEO. So I feel like that's an important wayfor us to reinforce the culture. We also did an exercise. I want to saythree years ago, where we put sort of a common language around our culture andvalues. So like Mogotabes, we have six core values. A some of themare like think. Big Go far build together, make it matter, beintellectually honest and when we did that exercise, I remember thingn tomyself like nothing really changed about our culture. We just put a commonlanguage around it and it really resonated with people- and you know,even when We'ere recognizing people, through our sales, all hands or oursalves kickoffs, we try to frame it in those common thei common set of valuesand that we defined several years ago. That's interesting, is there apsychographic? You know profile, as you guys have interviewed, hired, firedlots and lots of people any common themes or anythings that you think arespecific to Mongo in terms of the types of people that you're looking higere,particularly on the SALESID. So we try to be scientific about it. We actuallywe do an assessment. Every single person that gets hired and a sales roledoes an assessment to use a tool. Cult profiles xt and we took our top sellersand also our bottom sellers, and we tuned our assessment based on on thosepeople, and we try to refresh that every six to twelve months and thenassessment is broken down into three sort of core sections there, as likethe there is a section on their learning, their capabilities. IstBasically can they do the job and there's a behavioral section which isabout how to do the job and there's a third section about you know: Will theyenjoy the job so thereis different fassets on the assessment? There'sthings like you know, manageability and coachability: Are they managee, but canyou manage them? Can you give them advice fully peoble to follow ourplaybook there's a a score for something called accommodating. Youknow: Are they too accommodating with customers and Awle hold a line and holda customer cannibl Lo certain timeline, so we use that assessment to help usiterate and refine on our profile and also just to help us understand thepeople that were bringing on board- and you know where their sort of strengthsand weakness is an areas of development. Are and is dis at inform the I wouldimagine it informs the interview...

...process in the sense that if youdetermine that accommodation is a bad thing, then you find ways to test forthat and is it I guess the other question is sort of. Is it exclusivelybehavioral or you are you doing a lot of case studies and kind of assignmentsto gauge their ability to match to the profile that that platform is ourinterview? Process is pretty pretty rigorous, so they have to do theassessment. They have to do interviews and then they also do a challenge, sothey actually come in and present do a presentation and do pitch as if it wereto a customer. We're really trying to understand if they'll be successful inthe role and the other thing about these steps in the processess, it alsohelps them qualify us like. Are they going to enjoy doing this kind of work,putting to get the process of putting together the challenge helps, helpsthem qualify as well. So it's a combination of all of those things and,like you said, like you may say, see on the profile that somebody scoredparticularly high or low on a certain facet, and then you have to think aboutwell. If they have a certain score or certain or maybe they have a certainexperience gap, does a manager can the manager help cover those risks, becausethe manager has that you know experience. So it's also about againplayer position like you know if they don't have experience doing amultistakeolder sale, but the manager has a lot of experience with that. Thenmaybe we're okay, but if it were the case that neither them the manager orthe rap had that experience, then you know we might be in trouble. Do youguys use any kind of specific methodology when you're selling to thepoint of the multistakeholder, salor using value, selling or Miller Himan,or anything anything like that? So we have a few different frameworks that weuse. We worked with a consultancy called force management to come up withthe value framework, so you know the value drivers and then the the thingsthat sort of build off of that, and then we also use men pick to qualifydeals so metrics economic, oh my gosh, now I'm on the spot, petricxs is Thi, ITHEPII Pigis dat process- I isidentifmy pain, sees champion so yeah. So H. Those are some of the frameworksthat we use got it well. Another question I have is, I sort of you know,asked to few questions: offline about sort of building the revenue plan andthinking about Pere Productivity, but you've also been in charge of demandgeneration. So is the enterprise plan? Are you guys using PDRs or strs or youthinking about pipeline generation? Is it's the job of the REP to deliver theamount of pipeline that they need? And you know whatever? Whatever quota wegive them, which is you know, going to be FIVX THEIR OTE? That's how muchpipeline they're going to generate. So we do have ANSD organization, whichwe've done a lot of experimenting and iterating, on which I think is naturaland it's it's a good way to test things out and do lots of experiments becausethey're the least experience part of the organization. So it's really easyto pit in and come up with sort of new ideas and run them, and so we do expectsome pipeline from the from the strs. But at the end of the day we try todrive accountability with the raps like they should not be setting back waitingfor pipeline from an SDR or from marketing like ther, they own theirhihline in their and the the revenue that they're generating and in terms ofplanning. I work pretty closely with our FPNA team and building our annualplan, and there really are only three inputs to that which re is ourassumptions about sales, productivity, hiring and attrition, and we build oursort of annual plan based on those those three inputs, and you know what Ican sort of provide to the FPATM as they're building. That is that you knowokay, wo'rk WHATA, going to create this hiring plan, as m will actually go andstress test it with the sales leaders like okay, let's actually build an orkshark that that gets you to whatever hundred and fifty eas this year. Isthat realistic? Do we have the management capacity? Do we have theregions that we want to open up? Will we have enough solutions? Architects,things like that, so there's a little bit of back of forth. That happensbetween the finance team and the sales...

...organization, and I would assume thatthe in terms of sort of like themand generation like to the point of name itaccounts, it really comes down to territory, design and making sure thateach person has the right number of named accounts to get to whatevernumber you expect them to get to and that your job, an ops, is almost toprovide that reassurance. That listen were very, very confident that thisgroup of accounts will get you to the number that you need to get to. Doesthat sound yeah? It's interesting! You bring that up because we're spending alot of time, I'm thinking about territory, planning right now and doinga better job and a more sort of scientific job around territorymanagement. So we consider territory management, it'sultimately the job of the Rd to sign the accountast, because you know assystematic as we could be in terms of identifying data, their data. Thatindicates a good account. You know you have to also be able to match theaccounts to the people. So is that player position concept ride youwouldn't give you know a rep with very little field experience. You know anaccount like a big bank like Morgan Stanley, for example, because you'reust setting them up for failure, but we can provide the managers asintelligence to help them make those decisions, and you know we're actuallyin the process of of rethinking how we do territory management so we'reactually bringing in a consultancy to do some Deta Science analymics on ouraccount account bes to help us figure out, which are the accounts that wethink have the highest orpensity to buy, so that we can make it simpler for themanagers to assign those accounts and then we're also supplementing our count:Data with more intelligence from third party tools like Datafox and inside you,and things like that. So that's definitely a topic, that's very top ofmine because I think it'll have a big impact on sales productivity. If we canget the territories assign more scientifically yeah, absolutely beyondMongo, you know Y, U Youre an advisor to a bunch of realy stage companies.What are some of the trends patterns? You know what have you observed as anadvisor, maybe separate from your experience within Mongo DB, thatdetermines you know in some ways where you're finding that companies aresuccessful or unsuccessful. What are the common themes as you've been morepart of the STARTEC ECOSYSTEM? Given the the success IV, I'm going to beWhativ, I funny I mean I've been advising these early stagestartups, like one, for example, as called Concord. They got acchoired byAkami, an other is called honey comb and which is a product to helpdevelopers get insight into performance issues and those are pretty like mogoing to be pretty technical products and have technical, cofound ortechnical founders, who know may not have a lot of experience with sales andmarketing and in the place of like Hunni comb, a the CEO and found hercharity majors, like she's, pretty amazing, like she's, a engineer bytraining but like she is incredible marketing instincts, because she knowsthe developer audience so well. But in terms of like the insides, I feel likethe startups and the founders that do really well that are coming from atechnical background. Are the ones that are trying to figure out hone of theBest Practices I? What are the right ways to build a sales and marketingorganization? I'm really thinking about it critically, you! No, I think you andasked offline, like you know what some startup advice that you think is totalbullshit and I think a trend right now or theme right now is like Hey, justbuild an amazing product, its all about product and then your productis goingto go viral and you'll succeed, and I think that that may be true for a smallsubset of part products that have some inherent murality and have very littlecompetition. But for most of us most of us you know mere mortals. We Need Selesand marketing and you need to generate demand and, if you're not doing it,your competition is doing it and you're missing out. So I think that thosefounders that start thinking about it early and try to learn as much as thiycan and are open to feedback are the ones that are are really successful. Itmakes perfect sense. You know there's a part, as we sort of think about youknow paying it forward and some of the influences that you've had, and maybesome of the content that you've created. What advice would you give to otherfolks? Are there books that you've read that have been particularly influentialor even mentors that you want us to know about sure? So you know I thoughtof two things I thought were pretty...

...interesting. One is a podcast calledniney nine percent in visible. I don't know if you've ever listened to it, butit's all about design and the things that you may not notice around you thathave actually been designed or thought about at some point. So an examplewould be there's a really great episode about the calendar like. Why do we havethirty or thirty one days a month? Why do we have twelve months and it talksabout the different experiments that have been done around different kindsof calendars and there was actually a someone who worked at a railroad thatcame up with a calendar that was thirteen months for each month wastwenty eight days and it made it a lot easier to manage time tables and thatcalendar was actually adopted by CODAC. I think, as recently as like the s andthe reason I love this podcast is it gets you out of your head in terms ofyou know what what you think is t e best practice or what you think isnormal, because that's the way you can innovate is when you can step aside andsay hey. This is the prescribed best practice, but why do we do it this way?Do we have to do it this way? So I really appreciate that podcast callthnine te nine. I E tendid visil. The book I would recommend is predictavlyirrational by Daniel Arialli, which is is sort of similar in that it againgets you sit to. You know rethink conventions and it's all about the waysin which humans do things that seem counter intutive, and if you canunderstand human behavior, I mean, I think, that's sort of necessary to be agood sales or marketer so SA. That would be my recommendation. Those areso just repeating a back for the audience, predictably irrational andthen ninety nine percent, invisible is the podcast and in ferms of you know,sales leaders or even marketing leaders or any kind of leader who're some ofthe people that have been particularly influential that you know we shouldknow about. We should kind of Google and look hem up on like ten. You knowone or two folks that you think have been particularly important ll. Idefinitely learned a lot about marketing from moging to B Cmo,Meganisenberg who's, pretty well known, as well as our former CRO Carlosdilatory who's. Now the CEO of a company called Varia security, so Ithought it was pretty cool b. his well known he's famous. I hear about him allthe time yeah and it's pretty. I think it's a pretty amazing success storylike I was really bummed when he called me and said he was leaving, but when Ifound out he was becoming a CEO is like well, I get it. The other big influence on me isactually my father, inlaw Phil Moray who's, a had many marketing roles, he'had a marketing nou at a company called CYBEREX and out of Boston, so it'sreally fun over Thanksgiving and other holidays to be talking talking shop,talking about evercant waits and you know outbound versus in down SDRs, andthings like that. Absolutely are you from the Boston area, I'm actually fromNew York. Originally, I grew up in Queens my husband's from Boston, okay,cool awesome. Well, listen! Megan! Thank you! So much for your time on theshow, we really appreciate it. Congrats on the success at Mongo. Your careerhas been really really inspiring and any final advice for people. You knowso you mentioned the jungle jam. You mentioned Sher Samburg, any lastparting, words of wisdom. Before we hit the stop recording button as peoplethink about, you know how to be you, maybe even particularly F R, for someof the the women out there that are trying to navigate either career insales and marketing. I guess my advise to be to be bold and just sort of gofor it. I mean my one of my personal mattos is ready fire aim, so don'tworry so much about being perfect or having the perfect plan, like you know,it's better to take action, even if the action is wrong and learn from it,because inaction is also a decision and you'll get better results. If you justkeep trying and iterating on it, so just go for it and be confident.Absolutely we will do it. I assume, given what you just said, that you guysare growing. If people want to get in touch with you either to you know, seekyou up for mentorship to askying questions or even to apply for a job atMongo. Is there preferred channel through which people should approach?You is that, okay, how should people reach out if they heard something thatthey liked on this podcast and they want to connect sure I mean I'm on ALDTe Social Media Network so feel free to connect me I'm linkedin or on twitter,or you can just email me, my emals,...

...pretty easy. It's Megan, Meg Han atmonwudbcom, happy to happy to refer people for jobs were hiring like crazy,that's Great Megan, thanks, so much for being on the show and and we'll talk yosoon. Thank you right. I team at Sam Jacobs. This is Sam'scorner other great interview this time with Megan Gil from Mongo DB. She wasthe first non technical hire at that company and she helped them go public.Last year, they's been public for over year. I think Megan had a lot of reallyreally good insights into how to build and scale a complex enterprise, saleand one of the things that she mentioned is it's a heavy field salesorganization, where they put a lot of emphasis on the sales rof themselves togenerate pipe line. In fact, that's one of the corresponsibilities. They have aone, do one relationship between the sales person out in the field and thesolution architect, which is the sales engineer, which is the technical personthat actually knows with hows going on so one to one, and so they haveequivalently if they have a hundred and fifty people out in the field. Theyhave a hundred and fifty solution. Architects, although I think theactually she mentioned, that the ratio was sort of ideally three to one. Somaybe they have fifty solution. Architects in my math is wrong. Thepoint is that when Youare doing an enterprise sale, that's highlightcomplex, highly technical you're going to need to provide an invest intechnical support and part of that go to market motion is investing in salesengineering, atd support to assist the sales team. Now they did some analysis,and this was really interesting and they found that people with technicalbackgrounds and sales did do better, so they did better, but not a ton better.Nevertheless, it's pretty clear in the modern age that, if you don't havetechnical experience of any kind you're at a disadvantage relative to everybodyelse- and finally, I think what's really interesting- is that theyfigured out that the smaller the territory, the more productive, therept- and I think, we've all probably had some notion or some intuition thatthat might be true. But you know theyr their enterprise sellers are managing.You know she said twenty was a lot and I would think ten to fifteen and shesaid their top sellar managers just three accounts and it sounded like oneof them was a really big investment bank. So you guys have ever tried tosell the invessent banks. You understand why that's important there'sso many different people making decisions so many different lial littlepockets of budget, and it's really really difficult so make sure that whenyou're thinking about your territory, design and your name Thaccount strategythat you have the right ratio for the size of the deal for truly conflexenterprise sale, you might think about a territory. That's really only ten tofifteen named accounts. If that seller is a land and expand model where theycan grow the account over time, so before we go, of course what we want todo. We want to thank our sponsors. There they're the reason we all get tobreathe oxygen, etce big, shout out to aircall your advance call centersoftware, complete business, ponand contact center, a hundred percentnatively intcreated into any serum and ow reach a customer engagement platformthey efficiently and effectively engaged prospects to drive morepipeline and close more deals. If you want to get in touch with me, please doit. A lot of people have been reaching out to me and it's fantastic. You don'thave to just gen any positive fee back. You can tell me hey these of the typesof things that we want to hear on. The show. We've gotten a lot of feedback,we're working on new formats because of that feedback. So if you want to reachme, you can find me linked in twitter anywhere. You want Linton's, probablythe best it's Linkencom, the word in Im and then forrd sash, Sam F, Jacobs,linconcom in Sam f Jacobs. If you want to talk to me about Washington, sportspolitics or the singularity, you can find me on twitter at Sam s, Jacobs,I'll talk to you next time.

In-Stream Audio Search

NEW

Search across all episodes within this podcast

Episodes (347)