The Sales Hacker Podcast
The Sales Hacker Podcast

Episode · 2 years ago

40. How to Lead a Top Performing Inside Sales Team at a Public Company with Amy Appleyard, SVP of Sales, CarbonBlack

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

This week on the Sales Hacker podcast, we talk to Amy Appleyard, the recently appointed SVP of Global Inside Sales at CarbonBlack.  Amy walks us through her background from being an SMB entrepreneur to leading large sales teams and why sales emerged as her true calling. Amy combines raw intellect and analytical capability with a passion for sales resulting in an incredible and effective sales leader at a fast growing public company.

One two one twre three FO everybody at Sam Jacobs, welcome to thesales hacker podcast welcome back, it's really exciting to be in the heart oftwo thousand and nineteen we've got a bunch of incredible guests that arelined up for the year and we've got today on the show. Amy FPOYARD, the svpof global andside sales for carbon black amy is somebody that graduatedfrom Undergrad with a theater degree she's an entrepreneur. She started abunch of her own businesses in the theater industry, then went to businessschool, had a family joined staple's advantage in the finance team andultimately found her way to the sales organization where she ended up runningvery large teams and doing incredibly well and she's. She's got a great mixof analytical and strategic skills coupled with people skills, and shereally cares about the teams and the people that she works with. She reallysounds like a great leader and it was a real delight to interview her and she'ssort of a rising star in the Boston technology scene and the Boston salesleadership seene. So I'm really excited about the interview. Now before we getto the interview, we've got some sponsors we've actually got a brand newsponsor, so the first is chorus dot. Ai Chorus is the leading conversation,intelligence platform for high growth sales teams. They record transcribe andanalyze business conversations in real time to coach reps on how to become topperformers with Khoras tat, AI, more reps, meet quota, new hiers ramp,faster leaders become better coaches and everyone in the organization cancollaborate over the actual voice of the customer check out. KORUS TAT,aiforixs last sales hacker to see what they're up to our second sponsor is ourfriendly neighborhood out reached odio the leading sales engagement platform.outrige supports sales reps by enabling them to humanize their communicationsat scale from automating the Sol sucking manual work that eats upselling time. All of that soul. Sut. Don't get your soul sucked folks toproviding action. Oriented tips on what communications are working bestoutreach has your back so holpover to out reach Oud Ioe Ford, slsh saleshacker to see how thousands of customers, including carbon black, areusing outraks to deliver higher revenue per sales rep now without further Adou.Let's go to the interview everybody at Sam Jacobs and you're.Listening to the Sales Hacker podcast today, I am incredibly excited to haveamyapple yard, on the show. Amiapple yard is the SPP of global inside salesfor Carbon Black, a leading cyber security company specializing in nextGen and point security solutions and well talk about that. They just wentpublic but prior to Carpon, Black Amin was VP of sales for Logmian'scommunications and collaboration line of business. She's been doing sales forquite a while before moving into the tech. ECTOR AMY led staples businessadvantages, midmarket sales division and she also had positions in financestrategy and marketing at Saples and then before that she cofounded anentertainment based retail craft store, and I also think she ran a theatricallighting design firm based in New York. So we're really excited amy to have youon the show and thanks for joining us o thanks for having me, I'm a big fan ofthe podcast, so I'm honored to be here well that we, we love our fans. So it'sgreat it's great to CAE, I'm a five star Fan, that's great okay! So we knowyour name, your titles, officially SVP global inside sales. I kind of read alittle bit of the headline of Carbon Black, but it's always good to get sortof the overview from somebody that works there. So tell us, in your words,what carbon black does. Oh absolutely, so just a little background on thecompany. We are a Sivar security company based in Walfam, so justoutside of Boston about a thousand people in total, a couple hundredinside sales reps and were hovering it around two hundred million now withplans to keep on growing, which is part of the reason why I joined and my teamshelped to provide andpoint security solutions for it and securityprofessionals. We actually serve customers of all sizes, so SNBcorporate all the way up to Fortune. One hundred, but my inside teams focusprimarily on the SNDB and the corporate space e really yeah. So it's a it's abig big division, we're pretty excited about it, lots of growth opportunitiesand at carbon black. We really do believe that the en points are whatneed securing. So this is the the way modern daycyber attacks are happeningand the solutions that we provide really do make it easier for defendersto protect the en points and then harder for the attackers to get in. Soit's a really exciting space right now, it's a big total addressable market.There's a lot of folks out there doing similar things along the lines of ours,but we're pretty proud of what we built and the customers were servingcontinuing to ennovate and just having a blast doing so. That's fantastic, andso you join just post IPO. Is that right, that's correct, Yep and how bigis your team, so we have about two hundred on the inside, so ihave fourdirectors actually for female directors,...

...cots a good job. Thank you for Dan. Ihappened before I came. It was one of these was very impressive to me when I,when I heard about it, coming in learning about the teams, so it wasdefinitely something that made my eyes kind of you know. I got pretty excitedand eighteen managers, so roughly half of our folks Ar Sdrs, who help not onlythe inside teams but also Ar fieldsellers lineup appointments andkind of get the conversation started with our prospects and then the restare quota carriers, and so, when you joined was the team. This big has a Grimean, I guess when did you join just a couple months ago? I just signed acouple months ago and they had just gone through big growth over the courseof this year. This year, two thousand and eighteen. The company is reallyinvested in the mid market and continues to do so. So there's a lot ofroom for growth for us and all of these teams were built when I got here, butwe're still on a path to growth, so we are definitely hiring and alwayslooking for e best talent that we can find that's fantastic, so we're goingto dive into kind of your origin story as we might call it in a superheromovie, but I'm actually pretty interested just in what you just said.So you just inherited a very large team when you were leaving logmiin andthinking about and coming to carbon black. How do you prepare for that?What sort of steps did you take to try and have you know the right level ofinfluence around your onboarding, your personal on boarding into theorganization? And how do you build? You know, influence and advocacy withinsuch a large team as somebody that's sort of inheriting all of these hiringdecisions? Wha? What's your strategy? What's your philosophy? That's a reallygood question. It was definitely a lot of you know. Just we could have seemedlike big, nameless, faceless groups of people right to get to know, but I tendto take a pretty personal approach anyway and for me the goal was to dothat as fast as possible. So I had spent time with the directors when Ifirst came on board and then also with the management team, just kind oftelling them t explaining to them kind of who I was and what was important tome and what was important to me as a leader, but also just in terms ofgetting to know the company and the customer. I tend to be somebody whoreally digs into the details and it's not because I'm a micro manager it'sjust because I want to really understand things and then once Iunderstand it, I'm out I'm back up to the three thousand or the ten thousandof the hundred thousand FOT iew. So I asked them for help and getting to knowtheir teams and understand. You know their pipeline and everything that wasgoing on within the business as fast as possible and then set up just a seriesof round table discussions. Where small groups me with the manager and the teamcould be anywhere from eightten twelve people and do a lot of going around theroom, just making sure that I understood whoeverybody was and howlong they'd been with the company. I had asked for the managers to eachprepare a slide like a facebook slide, pick just a picture of them and apicture of in individual like the headshot type. You Know Linkedon typepicture of everyone on their team with their names and then jus some basiccontact information. How long they vote the company if they had movedinternally wed, do a lot of internal promotions here from we do the SDR path,all the way up to you know principal inside inside sales, rap and then onelittle bit of information like where they went to college or what theirfavorite movie was, because that little thing just helps me connect the nameswith the faces, and so I probably spent a good portion of my first month on thejob just doing round, table discussions and getting to know people, and then Iwould often through the course of these conversations, ask. What's yourfavorite product to sell or what are you you know? What's your favorite wayto overcome objections, and this would help me get connected to the product,so that was one strategy just for getting to connect the names to all ofthe faces and then the other was to really understand the customers asquickly as I possibly could, because I think that's of course, what we're allhere for so I tried to just fill my calendar connected pretty quickly withthe with our seteam our solutions, engineering, team and said film, mycalendar with as many demos pocs everything as possible. As you can hoany space you can find fill it because then I would get the you know thebenefit of not only meeting more of my sales dreps and getting to know them ona personal level. But listening in on what the questions the customers wereasking and getting to see themos of the products, so we do sell quite a fewdifferent things. We have a cloud based offering and there's a bunch ofdifferent blades on it and I neede to understand all of those things and thatreally helped me ramp up it. That I think answers your question. Yeah. No, it does it's was and did you feel? I guess I guess this is probablysomething that you negotiate with the CEO or you know as you come into theorganization, but you know you ere able to sort of say here's the cure, themilestones that I want to be held accountable to- and maybe it's like thefirst ninety days or a hundred and eighty days really I'm just going to bein kind of market development, research mode and then from there we can figureout what the right targets are. Is that sort of how you approached it? Yeah? Ialways hear about those no fly zones. You know where people can come in andthey have thirty days or six days or...

Ninedays to just watch and observe, and I'm not that kind of a person. So I do.I would love to think that I could do that, but I just cannot sit still so II had set expectations with our COO, who I report to directly an our CEOthat I would I would listen and learn and observe, and you know within thirtyto sixty days. I would just have some kind of a reed out of what I was wasseeing and where I felt like there were opportunities for us to either. Youknow, step on the gas or make some changes or Tweik to our sales process.Etce and after thirty days, I had a readoutfor MOR executive team was able to say like here's, what I'm seeing and here's,where I think, there's tremendous opportunity and and here's you know thenumber I think we're going to hit by the end of QFOR, because so by the way,we're in C for when I started wow. So so that was fun to try to figure thatout fast and then I also have worked in strategy and am able to. I think, justassess situations pretty quickly and kind of make a roadmap aphears. What weneed to work on and what here's, what he is to go for a second third, thatkind of thing. So I was also doing that in the back of my mind, as I wasgetting to know, people and understanding our numbers and what ourgrowth strategies were, and you know, plans for two thousand and nineteen. SoI was also kind of doing a little bit of that, like just my own internal,consulting like trying to figure out how to make the most of everything thatwe had and deliver more with everything that we have while that was happening.So I did that at thirty days and then I've just been kind of marched intothat roadmap since then- and we are closing in on the end of the quarterand super happy with the results, the teams are fired up and has been goingringing. Today we had one young woman who just hit plan and that's prettyexciting right, so that is exciting. So, for the listeners out, there wererecording this Ondecember e teeth, which is my brother's birthday, hapvybirthday Josh, and I guess there's you know Iofficially. I mean, would you consider there to be like to at this point? It'sthe end of the day, Tuesday. So three business days from your perspective,left in the air or you guys are pushing all the way to midnight on on NewYear's Woll go we're going to the end yeah. We are going to the end, well bein Ali a little bit after Christmas and then we'll definitely be in that Monday,we're all GOIN. No, I ACTU I'm going to try to challenge people to just come inin their pajamas or something JS to make it fun, because usually I layaround on the thirty first in my pajamas all day and watch movies, withmy with my three girls and my husband, so I won't be able to do that this weekbecause of where you know the thirty first falls, but it's worth it I'll bewith my with my new family. Here yeah I mean I wan you'll be having fun and youguys are. You guys are going to hit the number Oh yeah yeah, yeah e. We willhit it wer on his bandest on a path Yep. So well, there's so much! I want to wantto ask you about, but let's let's rewind a little bit and go back to thedays of Teter, which I mentioned in your bio. The listeners should alsoknow that you know I went to the unversity of Virginia. Sadly, and meyou graduated from Virginia Tech, so we're not Gonno we're not going Ta holdthat against you, wow hape, tokkes yeah. That's it and you know whats. It hasn'tbeen a rivalry and football liast for long enough that I have a like to standon, but you came out and you ere a theatermajor walkus through you know. You obviously don't have to give us everysingle last detail, but it is pretty interesting how you've evolved from atheater major to running. You know a sales team of two hundred people whereyou youknow, even even just in the last couple of minutes, Yor Youre R, you ere,emphasizing how good you are in terms of like your ability to forecast andhit the number, but also Ralli the troops. So how did that? How did thathappen? And how does theater inform what you're doing now walk us through alittle bit of the journey yeah? I will absolutely it's. I sound like a crazyperson. I know when, as you just describe me, but it actually all doesmake sense, or at least to me it does, when I kund of thread the justkind offilling the gap. So I was a theater major, but I also sstudied math andaccounting and justloved. All of that I was ov always been pretty analyticalwithin working in theater. What I was drawn to was lighting and theatricallighting design and there's a lot of organizational components to that.There's also a lot of ways: ouit's almost like applied math in terms offiguring out how you use lighting, what lit you use an in different situationsand at what distance and stuff like that, so it was. There was a definitelytechnical side of it. That was really appealing to me and it was also just alot of fun and I tend to be somebody who kind of runs toward risky situationso naturally upon graduation. I just moved to New York. I had never been toNew York before well once as a girls SCATT. I grew up in North Carolina soonce as a girl scout when I was like thirteen, but there I was with a coupleof suitcases and a thousand dollars in my pocket and trying to figure out likehow to make a go of it. But I had a network of friends. We had bund, ahandful of US had moved up and we found an apartment and just kind of started,carving out careers. And for me, what worked was I had done. He series ofsummer internships during my time at rigin attack, and so I had professionalconnections as well in New York, and I had a couple gigs lined up and onething kind of led to another, and I ended up just really forming a nicecareer very busy one, but lots of...

...travel, crazy lifestyle loved. What Iwas doing and thought that I could do that for quite some time. But then Iactually met my husband and, and we got, I met the man who would be my husband.We got married wanted to have children and I had had a very suburbanupbringing and we felt like maybe we needed to get out of the city for awhile to figure out what we wanted to do. You know personally andprofessionally, and I thought why not just have a baby and then go tobusiness chool. So that's what I did so. I started business school with a athree month old and took a couple years to study finance as well as nonprofitmanagement had the intention of going back into theater, but on the producingside. But I realize I think, just through other folks that I had met inbusiness school, that there were just there were parts of my brain that I wahadn't been working for a while and was ready to get that going again. Lovestudying corporate finance and really liked kind of energizing. All theanalytical side of my brain so ended up launching a small retail venture rightafter business school, which is how I fell in love, with kind of the retailindustry, which then led me to stayfoles, which seems a little strangebese that Oway to some. You know small entrepreneura ventures, but another biglife thing happened. I actually had twins, so I had had one child while andin business school and then and then had twins and knew that I needed tostop kind of burning the candle at both ends and thought. I should get probablya regular job. So through my hat in the ring for a position and finance atstaples and within a few weeks found myself sitting in a cube for the firsttime in my life and stable, amazingly was incredibly entrepreneural for acompany that was so big and there were real opportunities for people who, ifyou wanted to define your own career, you could. I was an strongly encouragedto look at other things other than just like your classic finance job. I had agreat manager who sort of pointed me in a few different directions and as soonas I found the sales organization, thet btob division within staples, I knewthis is where I belong. And so I started running strategy group andwould put together teams of people to find different initiatives that wethought could deliver additional revenue for the business. So there werea lot of you know clearly financial calculations that you had to do inorder to get. You know convinced somebody that you could spend somemoney to make more money and would just pull together different folks from thesales organization to try new things, and in that role I was able to getreally close to a lot of frontline sales managers. So people who wereworking on on inside sales teams, people who are working on field salesteams or B to be our hunting team who were out there pound in the pavement.You know trying to bring on net new customers and I really loved what thefrontline sales managers were doing and I felt a deep connection to them andafter running enough kind of successful initiatives, I was actually placed inroll leading all of our inside sale teams, our midmarket sales division,and at that point it was just my. I don't know if you've read the book GoinMeni by John Irving, but that was like the Oen maning moment. It was likewhere everything just came together- and I realized like this is my calling.I love working in sales, in particular inside love, the midmarket. You know Ireally like small customers, and I really like I just kind of livebycariously through our customers. So was appreciating that and also reallyliked the social component of sales, combined with all the kind of prep workthat you have to do behind the scenes, and it felt almost like working intheater right. There's a lot of there's the when you're in front of thecustomer when Youre backstage and that felt very comfortable to me and alsomost folks in sales, have an extremely high tolerance for risk, which was justas appealing to me as the folks and theater that I had been drawn to in myfirst career. So it felt like it just felt very similar, but I think a lot ofpeople tie their personal and their professional lives together in sales,and you do the same in theater. So it just felt at home and staples reallygave me great runway and let me do a tremendous amount. I was kind oflearning from folks in the Boston Tech Community, other colleagues that I hadgotten to know and trying to apply a lot of what the tech sales people Iknew were doing within their organizations to our inside salesdivision at Staples, which was not quite as Hightech. But we were able tointroduce a lot of a lot of tools and technologies and different salesprocesses actually started. Writing Business over the phone, which wasunheard of, like you, know, fired up a kind of dimansion engine coming fromthe marketing team had great partners there who were willing to rethink howwe served the mid market and appreciated that and loved all theteams who kind of came with me along that journey, because it was a changefor sure and then, through that I ended up meeting some folks from them Logbeanand was asked to come over and and lead inside teams there. So that's when Ijumped from distribution into intosast sales and then recently moved to carbonblack. So it's been no looking back since I hit sales for sure and I'mreally comfortable and happy working in the Texh ector now because it reallybrings together my love of technology as well yeah, I mean it's an amazingstory. I guess: Were you surprised that,...

...like sales or that you even ended up insales, I have to imagine you know a theater sort of drama background, maybemaybe like a little left, leaning, maybe not not thinking of yourself astwo mercenary and then in finance and being highly analytical and then andthen all of a sudden, you're in sales and sort of, as you mentioned,realizing that that was your calling. How what was that kind of realizationlike, and I guess, for a lot of people out there- it's very difficult to majorin sales, so lots and lots of people aren't sure whether this is a careerfor them. What is your advice to people? How do you know it's a career for you?What are the elements that really resonate? Yeah? That's a good! That's a!I like how you asked that question tha, because people have asked me similarthings, but never in quite that way, but I think in terms of resonating, andhow did I know this is what made sense to me. I actually have A. I have asixteen year old, daughter now and she's thinking about college. You knowhow do you know what you want to do for the rest of your life and I don't thinkyou ever know what you want to do, but when I started working in sales I justI felt like myself like. I just felt like. Oh this. I know what I'm doinglike this. Actually, I'm much more confident, I'M UST! I really enjoy this.This makes a lot of sense to me. So thate was just a natural feeling there.It was never anything that I could have planned and I think now youoccasionally hear about. There are some schools where you can major in sales oryou would learn a lot about sales. I know Mo Marko bars just joing somegreat work teaching at pit Harvard at HBS people how to you know how youwould actually stand up sales organization and all that you wouldneed to do, but I never thought of it as a profession. It just sort of I fellinto it because it made me happy, and I think you get that positivereinforcement when you feel like you're good at something and you're happy, butI couldn't have planned for it with that said, I do talk to a lot ofyounger folks who are thinking about it, people who might be in marketing andthey think maybe they should try sales, and I always say you, soul, absolutelytry if you think you have any interest in it, because you will learn so muchabout the business and about the customer, and it just gives you theseincredible building blocks for anything that you might want to do, especiallyfor somebody in marketing who might be interested, because if you can actuallysay that you've sold, you have so much more credibility with any salesorganization you ever might want to serve if you head back into themarketing role. So I think that answered your question, but for itwasn't a plan, it just happened and it had I'm really happy that it did yeah Werl. You self conscious that, because,if I understand correctly kind of went from a an operation, finance positionto running ate, have you ever sort of carried a bag on your own or carried aphone? I guess Awell, so the I've always had thehustle right. So when I was a theotrical Igtin Zenner, it wasbasically it was an LLC right. So I sold my myself my skills I had to fitin ten twelve shows a year in order to make a decent living right. So I livedin New York and there was a lot of networking. There was a lot of figuringout how to kind of Selfpromote, so in that way, you're selling- somethingthat's pretty intangible right, because you can take pictures of a show, showyou might have lit or hopefully get somebody to a show that maybe you wereinvolved with to see your work, but that was definitely a sales role andthen, when I had launched the retail venture, the colleague that I lonchd itwith we had actually written the business plan for kind of a capstonecourse in business school and were approached after we had given a youknow for a panel of judges. We had done the final presentation we aeppoached bya couple folks and asked if we were looking for funding and if we had aterm sheet, so we weren't even planning Thi starte to go into business until wewere approached in that way and within three four months we had, we wereSEACORP and we were raising money and we got the thing up and running andthen we realized about a year after we had sput pend o paper to start thebusiness plan that we were kind of open for business and we had to bi out ofsell stuff right. So ten it was like wow we got. We have employees and wehave to come up with a sales methodology in a process and a plan,and that was probably the closest thing tocarrying a bag that I've had and then at saples. The teams that I was workingwith, I would go out on sales calls. I would spend a lot of time on the phonewith people trying to see how customers would react, but I wasn't quote acarrying in those roles initially, not until I moved into sales leadership. Soit is definitely a nontraditional Pan, but one that I think has served me welland perhaps in a unique way, because I think I can have a perspective on thebusiness. That is the ten thousand foot view or the thirty housand or hundredthousand footview. You know I can look at kind of big strategic things that wemight need to do and not be immediately connected to how challenging they canbe, which I think is sometimes one of the hardest steps when you' come upfrom having been a quote, a carring rap to a manager to a director every stepup that you get in that level of leadership, you're having to make moreand more difficult decisions and separating yourself from the impact,the direct impact to a Rep. maybe is easier for me, because I didn't sit inthat seat with the headset on and try...

...to work. My way toward a a big giantquota, you know from day one of a new fiscal year. You just said somethingincredibly interesting. So your point- and this is- I don't know if it waspattent- it was some general talking about how you know too much. Empathycan be almost be a bad thing in the sense that you have to be able to maketough decisions. Are you talking about, for example, decisions to raise quotaor decisions to commit to a number around a new product before you haveenough market feedback? Are those some of the decisions where, if you've comeup directly from the ranks, maybe Youre Two absorto sensitive yeah? Absolutely.I think that I think that is the hardest thing for folks, especiallymoving from a manager to a director role is when you kind of turn that hatfrom, like really empathizing with the WEP. To being that it is company firstright that that is a very difficult thing for many people to get over, andit doesn't mean I probably then overempathize in other situations withthe reps, because I do understand how challenging it is we're going throughterritory planning now we're building out. You know assigning quota for nextyear, and you know I really want everything to be like, from a parodyperspective, from Rep to rap, from manager to manager. I'm like takingantying everything, because I'm over empathizing with somebody who mightthen feel like. Oh this, my patch isn't as equal to the person who's sittingnext to mes patch, and so I probably overindex on a few things, but you canfigure that out with the number. So so I'm really comfortable there but yeah.I do think that it's a great thing for many people to learn, and I think thatI can provide perspective and Hav certainly helped coach people intothinking slightly differently, and you know tipping the scale more towardcompany first, as opposed to individual first wow, that's m: That's very difficult todo. What's the advice that you give or is there a or is it just hay, you knowyou have to stop thinking that way like how do you? How do you do that for anupand coming manager? Yeah, I mean, I think, for first you got to understandwhat they want. What their career growth is right. Maybe a Managerisreally happy just being a manager, but if they want to go further being ableto demonstrate that you can separate yourself from the immediacy of some ofthe decisions is important and people that I have coached usually are comingto me for advice. You Know How dids you do it or how do I get ahead? How do Ithink about this differently? I think it is a message that I try to send outto folks, and if people are receptive to it, there are ways to coach aroundit right, knowing that it will be a blocker likeit just will. If you can't make a decision that is in the best interestof the company and the you know, you always have desegmentation challenges.This should be mine, this shouldn't, be you know, and then you got to thinkabout W wheres. That's a great opportunity right. If somebody feelslike this is 't my patch, but I actually know no, that really belongsto the field right. That is not one of ours. Having somebody understand and beable to tell you why it makes sense to move that one to the field, becauseit's going to be better served by the customer or maybe that customer doesneed a regular check in or we think, there's a bigger opportunity there thatbe better for the company if it sits with the field, that's a tough one, butthat those come up a lot right. So that's a great opportunity to talk tosomebody about what they want to do kind of longer term- professionally,Hey, let's think about this, for the whole of the business and maybe itsoftens the pain of you know. Having lost a large accounterlord opportunity,that's a great teachable moment, even as painful as it can be. Yeah I meanit's A. I remember in one of one of the companies where I worked a one of themanagers, the midmarket manager. We had a rule that if it was enterprise, theenterprise controlled all of the subsidiary companies of that largeconglomerate and the mid market manager came and said. We've got were all theway down the sales cycle with this one company and we just did a littlehoover's research and realize theyre subsidiary. What should we do, and Isaid well, we've already decided to what the rules are. Yeah. You have togive it to the enterprise deam. So then you can make fun of them for chasting,two thousanddollar deals right. Five thouzanddollar deals. That's what I donot getting, I'm getting, ACTUALL MIGH BOOK! Shame! I might have done that. Afew times what you mentioned, that you reallylike mid market and SMB, and you really like inside sales and of course to yourpoint- you've been that customer you've run SNDB businesses on your own andunderstand the challenges. But when you think about kind of even tactics andmethodologies, what are some of the core? You know competitive advantagesthat you think you bring to the table when you're running an inside salesteam that you think really are helpful and help make that team run run on timeyeah. So I'm I think, like most inside sales. I just don't know if this isanything unique to me, but I think I'm very processed oriented and processdriven, and I believe that activity begets sales right like there's a corset of things that we should all be doing on a daily weekly monthy basisand that that will set us up for success to meet our bookings targetrights. But you got to do these small things along the way to get there. So Ido spend quite a bit of time talking about the sales process, ensuring thatwe have the right one and that we, as as a management n leadership team,actually can spell out. You know whate of the five things that everybodythat's our job like we have to figure...

...out. You know how many phone calls howmuch pipeline? What are the things that you need to do to be successful and wehave to figure that out. So that's kind of the handshake with my teams is thatI'm going to work really hard to make sure that we've got the formula right,but you have to commit to the formula and we might tweak it along the way,but we believe that this is what will lead us to success. So I think that'swhere the like analytical side of me comes in, but then you can also reallypersonalize it, because if people commit to the activities that webelieve will deliver success, then we will be successful. It also, then lessyou kind of back your way into Wel Gos. If you're doing four of the five thingsis there. Some reason why you're not doing the fifth right, like? Are youmaking a ton of dials getting great conversations building a lot ofpipeline, but you just aren't booking everything like there's something youprobably don't have to close like? Maybe we need just o get you somespecial coaching on closing or negotiating, or maybe you'rediscounting too much like thore's helps us identify like what needs to beworked on to help everybody get to being. You know attain to attaining. SoI would say: That's probably the core thing going for me. I also just Ireally like I love an inside sales slore. I love the energy and the Bibeand walking around in the morning and just talking to people or just pickingup on you know when the throughout the course of the day, things kind of Peekin the ebb and the flow. I am a big Fan of like group exercise right, so I'llgo, do it spin, class or yoga class, or something where there's a lot of peoplewith individual goals all in the same room, trying to achieve the same thingin a given time frame, and I think in inside sales for can be a lot of thatas well. So I love to kind of set the tone for what we accomplished and haveeverybody have a personal goal, but also all of us have a collective goaltogether. Think those are, I don't know that those are unique, but I thinkthose are a few of the ways that I kind of think about running an inside team.I know you're like you're the big deal guy, I'm on the mid market. I love thatpredictable engine that we can provide to the rest of an organization justhigh velocity. We know it's coming if we fire up the demand Gen and get allthe leads flowing, we absolutely can deliver x because we've defined theprocess that to me yeah powerful, I mean my world is scary and how binaryit is. You know Lov yer thear, like a lumpy, thase big deals and then the yougot to have. If we're going to I this, if this orgas going to grow or anythingis going to grow, you really need some kind of predictable revenue engine andI think thet mid bark it with most products. He there's an opportunity forthat. Do you have? Do you guys use band or do you have a?I guess I have sort of two want o Tactoa question like what's yourqualification methodology and then the second is do believe that it matters.Do you know, do you bring a specific kind of sales process or you know adifferent, specific whay? You want to architect the sales cycle in terms ofentry and exo criteria for sales, for stages that you think makes adifference. What's your point of view and sort of qualification and salesmethodology, and how do you approach that Yeah Yeah? So I love the questionand it's something that I've been spending a lot of time talking withpeople here about I'm most familiar with Bant, that's what we were using itat Lagnian. It was really built into the sales process and appreciated thathere there's been a history of using medpick, but there's also some BAquestions worked in there'. It's a there's, a few different things:stilistically that are happening. We have a company that has grown throughThereis, an acquisition, there's kind of a smushing together of salesmethodologies, and I think one thing that we'll do for next year is reallyget it to be all the same, so much more similar and very tied to specificallywhat we're selling and what we need kind of at each point in the salesprocess. So I don't think medpick will go away. I think that's been here for awhile man. I expect that we'll will sick with that. You know we have it's avery. We have a very technical buyer and we do need to make sure that we'regoing slow and kind of checking all of those boxes through the process. Sothat's probably what we'll stick with yeah and and for me, I do think youneed something. I think you need something if for no other reason thanjust to provide something to coach from right, because if everybody's all overthe place, it's hard to just say like hey, you know what th you know ninetimes out of ten. This is going to help you. If you just follow this path andpeople tend to like a path an they sure do. But it sounds like your poiyt,which I think I probably fundamentally agree with this. It's you need. Youneed something, but you know there's not going to be a massive difference ifit's Medpick or medic, or medical or Bant or whatever it's just. You needsome kind of framework. That's consistent, yeah! Yes, yes hundredpercent, so one of the you know, there's a there's, a there's, a prettybig. I don't know if it's an elephant in the room, but it's but it's a fectof life, which is that you have three kids and you know you you've chosen areally difficult path and you're. You know you're kicking ass at it, butwhat's your advice I mean, I think, specifically it's harder candidly forwomen than for men, even with you know, or striving for genderequality a lot ofthe household duties and domestic duties may be based on you know,centuries of stereotypes, but they...

...still tend to fall disproportionatelyon on women. How have you thought about your career? How do you think aboutgiving advice to because we want you know we need and want more women andexecutive physicians in executive sales positions. What's the advice that yougive to the up and comers, and how do you lay that foundation for the future?And how did you approach it yeah? I do like this question and I have I tend tospeak pretty openly and freely and personally, when ask questions likethis, because I do have a lot of young women asking me. So I'm glad that youasked it and there's a couple different things that happened for me one is Imarried the right Guy Right, so my husband is amazing and we it's a partnership and we had apoint in our kind of crazy lives where we made a decision that I really lovedmy job and I loved working and that we would sort of organize around thatright. So his career took a little bit of a backseat or maybe a sideseat, Ithink, maybe I's in the passenger seat. But it's it's still important to him.But it's not as important as mine as to me just in terms of like defining who Iam and what makes me really happy. So he actually after the twins when thetwins were got probably three. Four years old, he made the decision to workfreelance from home, so my husband'sa writer he's a technical writer andworks in the health care industry and had worked at enough different placesthat he could kind of contact folks and build up a little bit of his ownclientele and we were comfortable with him. You know making the leap when weneeded it and that then turned in that was like oneof the best decisions we ever made. So I think he probably would like to getback into an office environment and not be alone. You know, for many hours ofthe day, writing and talking by a conference call and- and you know, goto meeting, but he is doing well and he spends a ton of time with AU girl. Sohe knows how to put you know the hair in Buns for ballet. He can do. Hedrives car pools, he's on a more of a texting basis with all the MOMS in myneighborhood than I am arranging playtes after school. There was aperiod of time. wherekids would often just pile into our house in the morningand he would drive everyone up to school, because there were quite a fewMOMS who work in our neighborhood and they knew that my husband would be homeand ther were. I knew there were more kids than there were seat belts in thecars when he was ta when he was driving everybody up to school, but id just letthat pass, because I was on my way to work. So I think we had a good kind ofbalance there. I'll also say that there comes a point where you just got todecide like am I GOINNA? I don't Cook like you know, I would rather on thenights where I offerd to do dinner. Why order out or I order in for us or Itake people out or you do something different, I'm happy to have to pay forsomebody to clean my house, I'm happy to do like there are things that I justdon't put a burden on myself and I think that that is. Was it ust, achoice or a decision that you make when I have free time. I want to spend itwith my family and there's plenty of people who are willing to help,especially if you can you KDON t pay them to do the cleaning Roor. That yardwork is the things that just aren't a priority for me right now. That makessense, but do you believe, of course it does, and you know, as my wife willtell you I am, I am a serviceas guy. I want to pay somebody to do basicallyeverything, but I was trying to get some pay tosomebody clean my closet, and she said I I have to do that myself still, but that's yeah. Of course it makessense. Do you believe that people can have it all? You Know Sheryl Sanburgsays Lenin. She also happens to be a billionaire. You know. Is that possible?I think you just Kitd tof define what your all is and I think it ebs andflows right. This is what we're doing for now and like everything is working,but it might not always be this way. I think one of the things I really loveabout working in sales is that the personaal professional lives can soblend together. I think also working in sales. You have a lot of flexibilitywith your schedule right. So if you need to get to a doctor's appointmentwith your daughter or if you need to go and see a ballet recital, there areways to work around it. You still got to hit your number, but you can hetyour number in a different way like it doesn't have to be in the traditionalnine to five glued to a desk. So I think that has provided a lot ofopportunity for me, but I migt when I you know, I got my list that I work.I'm a big listmaker when I work through my list or when I organize my calendar,half of it is workstop. Half of it is personal, it's all blended together!That's just! I don't think if it is a balance. I just think of it as this ismy life yep and it's all te new phrases, worklife integration as pos to workwith Bo Yeah Yeah. So one of the things while we're on th the topic of sort oflike you know, life optimization, you know, there's this twitter, meme or,and people make fun of it, of course, but you know all of the best people.Wake up at four: am you know, there's this them or this idea held among somepeople that you have to grind that. You know success is a grind and it is a agrind of twenty hour days or eighteen...

...hour days, and you don't believe thatwhat's your approach and give us sort of your reaction to that sentiment thatyou know if you're, not if you're not burning the candle at both ends thatyou're not you're, not strong enough to make your career work yeah. I think so.I definitely was in the work like crazy mode for a while in mylife and realize you know you get tired, like you can't you're, not making tedecisions, you're getting frustrated youre, if every time you see an oldfriend, you say: Oh my gosh everything's, so crazy, like that's.Nobody wants to hear that anymore. Let alone like me like. I was tired ofsaying it, so I then just realized, like I probably could get more done. IfI didn't try to burn the midnight you know just I just put I some structurearound my life like there's things that I do. I don't get up efore. I do get upat five though, but that's because I really enjoy working out in the morningand having just time to myself, I love having a cup of coffee reading thepaper and whattim. What time do you go to men?It depends on if I'm trying to catch P on work or emails, but anywhere in thenine thirty ten to Elevenn. Thirty twelve range, five, six hours, sleep, I'm good, butseven, eight hours, afsleep, I'm great. So if I can get that sleep like, I know,I'm just going to really kick butt the next day right an accomplish a lot andI try to leave every day by a reasonable time to get home in time fordinner, and I try not to get back online is a little different ent aquarter as my family will tell you, but I try not to get back online until intothe evening if I need to do emails, but there are also portions during the dayat work, where I make sure that I am spending time with people gettingespecially a new job now getting to know people, but I always try. I haveeither lunch or coffee or something were you just like relax and you're,not staring at your laptop or multitasking, and just I'm happier thatway- and I think I make better decisions and you're better atlistening when you're not doing a million things. I will say I mean thereare points of time during the fiscal year, certainly where you got ta pull not all Miters, but you have to workreally really hard, but that's not a way that I can that I am good at likemaximizing my output, I'm better when there's a balance- and there are thingsthat I have I just I need to do at least five times a week like workingout and just having some time to myself, and so I make sure that happens sometime with friends, time with family. Those are all important things and Ithink they make me better and stronger at work. I'm sure you're correct. I am,but this may be me rationalizing my own laziness, which happens what's so we're coming to to the end ofthis conversation. This has been amazing and what we like to do is payit, for we like to figure out, what's influencing you, what people haveinfluenced you so when you think about vpzof sales or chief marketing officers,ORE chief revenue officers, that you know either have have you admire orthat we just you think we should know about, give us some name. So we can doa little googling and linkedin searching and- and we up on some folks,absolutely wllalso a couple of I just my strongest mentors from steaples.They have both recently left, but Neil wringle, who was headed up all of theNorth American commercial division and the Ser Goodman. Who, when I knew hermost, she was the CEO and provided great coaching and mentoring for me.But then, of course, Larry Dangelo at Logman is just a phenomenal CSO and hasjust a legacy of growing grooming talent. So he's just incredible in theBun in the Boston Tech Community and then a couple folks that I reallyadmire. One is a guy named Josh Allen who was at Logman just prior to myjoining. He left to go to Cargaroos, got them through their IPO and now he'shead as sailes adrift, so he's just a wonderful person and just has had agreat career like something that you know everybody kind of points to inadmiration and just has a good, very disciplined way of leading sales teamsthat everyone remembers and is been recognizes. There's also a gayame BobMarsh, who I really admire, who found at a company called level eleven thatmade a it's a sales enablement tool that that I used at Saples werethinking about using one of the pieces of it here to help us build out a scorecard. I like him because he was a sales guy who had that a sales manager and hehad somehody needed and he had he went and made it right because he didn't hecouldn't find what he needed on the marketplace. I thought that was prettycool and then it's pretty cool yeah and there's a couple personal Mento, somewomen that I've gotten to know in the Boston area, who have really beenhelpful to me personally and professionally. But a woman named LisCane who's with openview venture partners, Kara Gilbert, N Asastas, acat there's, there's a great group of women in the Boston Tech Community whoall bone together and make sure we have. You know drinks at least once a quarter,but those three are certainly part of my part of my close network awesome anybooks. You think we should be kind of reading books that you think haveinformed your salves philosophy, yeah, I'm I love to read and just kind ofconsume anything books podcast. I have just a stack of sales books. You knowby beside the bed that I'm trying to make my way through there's a few thatI always come back to and a couple of...

...them. I'm in you know kind of rereadingnow and sharing with my leadership teams here at carbon black one iscalled cracking the sales management code. It's an incredible book, JasonJordan, Michelle Vazana, but it really puts out there this kind of a lot ofreplaces a lot of importance on managing to the metrics, like makingsure that you actually are managing not to some elusive booking number. But toactual you know, activities that can be managed, which is something that Ireally also believe in, and they write some in there about just theimportance of the finline sales manater as being just the big greatest point ofleverage within any insidesales organization, and I a hundred percentbelieve that there's a book I often suggest to folks that are on myleadership team to read, which is called it's your ship by CaptainMichael Abreshovf, and it really just has great management philosophy,perspective, love that book and and I've come back to measure what mattersthe Gen dor just trying to figure out how to set okrs in a new job in a newputlike. It's hard right, it's hard, and so that I have that one on audio Ta. Ilisten to that unaudible awesome and then last you know any mottos orprinciples. Any phrase you want to leave us with as we head offinto thesunset I love and where mentreband be here now, just like be present just bein the moment, enjoy every minute of your career of your time. You know ofyour day. I think don't don't rush, because life just just kind of going tohappen- and I think you can just be present- is thebest way to make the next wonderful thing happen. I love it amy. Thank you so much forjoining us on the sales hacker podcast. It's been a great conversation and hopeto talk to your meet you soon. Thank you for havving me, everybody. It is Sam Jacobs. This isSam's corner and really really enjoyed that conversationwith amy appigard. She has just the right combination of skills required tobe a really effective sales. Later she's got the right level of empathy.She's got the right analytical approach and she also she just has a passion forsales itself. So I think that there was a lot to learn, particularly listen,two points, and one of them, you know, is not really sales related per se, butit's just about how to get along in life. We talked about how she'smanaging a family of three and while she went to business school and was sheruns a team of over two hundred people and what she said was she had an honestconversation with her partner with her husband and they divided up theresponsibilities and her husband is the guy that stayed at home and helpedraise the kids and tackled the majority of the domestic responsibilities andamy was the one that decided she wanted to pursue. The career make her careerthe priority from an economic perspective for that family. I thinkwhat it tells you just if you're, in a relationship out there, honestcommunication is always so important. It's important with the prospect it'simportant with your partner, just establishing the right framework forhow you both are going to make decisions whatever type of partner youchoose, so sort of a random non sales, but kind of sales. All about theimportance of authenticity and honesty when it come an effective communication.Here's the second thing that she said, which is directly related to salesmanagement. Man. Wasn't it interesting when she said you know? Sometimes theproblem that upandcoming managers have is that they empathize too much withthe individual rep, whether it's with territory, design or with a disputeabout you know which lead belongs to which person, but you have to be ableto distance yourself from the team, and I see this time and time again. FirstTime, managers, you know when they say my team, they mean the people thatreport to them. They mean they mean the people that they control and that's notthe way to think about it. The first team has to be the company and you youknow you read about that in the inlenciones book, the five disfunctionsof a team, but really your first responsibility as you go higher in theorganization, is to the company itself and the more you think that you aresimply an advocate on behalf of the people that you manage, frankly, theless reliable you are to senior management, because you are constantlyadvocating you always want to bring home the rays and the better complan.You can always do that. Sometimes you need to be the one explaining thedecisions that the company made back to the individual reps and buildingconsensus from the top down to the people that you work with really reallyimportant reach out to me. If you have any questions about that, because I'veseen so many people fall into traps now, you'll find this podcast on itunes orGoogle play. We know you're kind of a big deal. So if you enjoyed thisepisode, you whoever you are, if you're on your, if you're in the car rign apullover, just pull over, get out your phone and share this episode onLinkedin share it on twitter or elsewhere. If you've got a great ideafor a guest or for a piece of content, get in touch. So if you want to get intouch with me, find me on twitter, at same of Jacobs or on Linkdon atlinoncom in Sam ef Jacobs, an we'd love...

...to hear from you once again a big shoutout to our sponsors for this episode, which is Chorus Tot AI and outrage theleading sales engagement platform. We will see you next time.

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