The Sales Hacker Podcast
The Sales Hacker Podcast

Episode · 2 years ago

Friday Fundamentals: EP 31: Building a Buyer Centric Funnel

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Let's do an exercise. Get out a piece of paper and draw your sales funnel. What gaps do you notice? We're chatting about gaps in the sales funnel, how to identify them and asses your funnel from your buyers perspective! 

Hey everybody, it's Sam Jacobs. Welcome back to the salesacer podcast and happy Friday. It's Friday fundamentals. We're back with this week's guest, David Scotch, serial entrepreneur and general partner at Matrix partners in, one of the early people that popularize the entire recurring revenue SASS softwares of service business model. Before we dive in, we want to thank our sponsor. David's going to talk to us about funnels, but before we do that we want to thank outreach. Outreach triples the productivity of sales teams and empowers them to drive predictable and measurable revenue growth by prioritizing the right activities in scaling customer engagement. With intelligent automation, outreach makes customer facing teams more effective and improves his ability into what really drives results. Now we've got David on the show and what we want to talk about as funnels. So, David, the question for you is you've done a tremendous amount of thinking about funnels and about the different constructions, the different flavors, the different designs. What have you learned? What are...

...some of the key lessons you've learned as you've been thinking about funnels for a business. Yeah, thank you, Sam. So I think the the one of the funnest experiences I have is going and sitting with a company and asking them to draw off the funnel for me and find where it's broken and see if I can't help them fix that broken point. And in doing that I've realized something, that is that there's an incredibly common problem that I see taking place in the way funnels get designed, and that is that they're designed often around the founders or the sales and marketing folks going to a conference or having experience at a prior company or looking at a company that they think is fabulous that they want to emulate, and then building a funnel that looks a lot like what they've seen and learned from that other company there. And in my view, that's a hundred percent the wrong way to go about funnel design, and the right way to go about funnel design is to think about what your buyer does in their buyers journey and think about what steps are needed to actually support that buyers journey. And when you do that you end up with these...

...breakthroughs that I'm typically able to help companies with when I look through their funnels. So maybe one cool way to think of this is imagine a website that has just a video and a description of your product on it and has a tenzero dollar price tag for your product per annum and a button which says buy it now, and ask yourself the question, do you think customers will press that ban? When I ask an audience that question, they will say now, nobody's going to, you know, buy something for tenzero dollars after just watching that video. And the question is why? You know what what specific things have to be sorted out before they do feel comfortable to buy that product? And you start getting then into understanding. Okay, what is it that influences hard buyer thinks and setting? One of the first things that I like to to relate to is where they and the buying cycle. So let me give you a couple of stories here. Imagine that you're at it. You're going to a train station to pick up your partner and you've arrived there early and next order that station is a nice clothing store. You Wander into the...

...clothing store. You're really just looking to waste time. You Don'tn't have anything particular purchase in mind and as soon as you walk in the door the salesperson comes over and says, high you know, I'm John and what are you looking for today and can I help you? And he said, well, I'm really just here at brass so if you don't mind. And then, you know, about two seconds after you start browsing, they come over again and in their hands they've got a pair of pants that they want you to show you. They say, you know, these just came in from Italy and we think that they would look terrific on you. Would you be how do you feel about that salesperson in that situation and sound? I'd be a question for you know. How do you feel about being being constantly badgered by that salesperson? A leading question? I wouldn't like it, David. I don't want to be constantly badgered, particularly if I told them already that I'm just browsing, that you're just browsing, right, right. So now a different story here, which is you go into North strums, you're on your way to a black tie wedding. You don't have a black tie and you need to find one quickly. You look around, you can't figure out where...

...the hell these black ties are and now you try to find a salesperson, but you can't find a salesperson. How do you feel about not being able to find a salesperson in that second situation? Deeply frustrated. Yeah, and so. So why? It's interesting to ask a question. So why do you want the salesperson in the second situation? Why do you not want them in the first cell situation? And the answer really lies in the fact that in the first situation you're super early in your buyers journey. You're really not at the point where you figured out whether you want to buy something and you're in the early stages of awareness, and in the second one, your way down the cell cycle, you're right down at the purchasing phase, and so you have totally different forms of treatment. And so I think one of the common mistakes that I see with most websites and salespeople as that they assume that everybody who's hit that website is already ready to be sold and they want to pounce on them and kind of annoy that the the hell out of the poor customer. So that's one of the things. Then there's another interesting characteristic of the buyers mind. That's useful to learn. That is triggers. So certain...

...things act as a trigger to get you to actually change your place from in that cell cycle to actually being actively interested in buying something. So, for example, a lot of people will not bother buying backup software or implementing backup software, and the trigger that makes them suddenly by it is when they have a crash of one of their machines and they lose their data. Or you won't buy antivirus software until finally you get hit by a virus. Or if you're moving houses, that will act as a catalyst for you to go and, you know, do a whole bunch of things like signing up with a comcast or a you know, files Foriz and file. So so those triggers are worth understand. Any one of the questions that I often ask companies is, do you know what the trigger is that causes your buyer to buy your particular product and can you find a way potentially to create that trigger? And one of the stories that I love was the hub sports story where they introduced this thing called website greater and it was a very cool free tool that was...

...used by any marketer to valuate with their website, was scored well on search engine optimization and at the end of it you've got this very, very professional report that told you everything was wrong with your website. But of course, yeah, yeah, you know, it gave you the score. Then it turns out that if people get alow score like a fifty five out of a hundred, it turns out to be a trigger for them to actually be concerned that they need to do something to fix it, and so that actually gets them to start figuring out and you know, what can I do, and that leads to them stalking to help spot in those days, to find out how hups, what could help them fix that problem. So that's an example of the fact that you can actually create a trigger, sometimes not always, but at least being aware of it's very important because then you can actually ask customers if they've gone through that trigger point to help act as a qualifying question to know if they're really serious or not about buying a product. And those that have been triggered, you know, are going to be very good prospects for you. And I'm sorry, good guy. Yeah, I was going...

...to say it sounds like also that part of the sort part of the mandate. It is to design a comprehensive buyers journey and then to create on ramps for your customer so that they can choose, based on where they are in the process, where they want to enter your funnel. Yes, beautifully summarize. Thank you. Yeah, you couldn't have said it better myself. That was great. You know, a subsequent thing that I've done here is to work with a lot of companies on their funnels and when the way that I work with them is I typically sit down with a big white board and I say, let's draw out you what your funnel looks like, what are the steps that your buyer has to go through, and when they get to things like a journey through their website or a journey through a free trial, I really go into micro details and break that those, every single one of those steps down, because it turns out to be incredibly important to your conversion rates of how you have a Web bsitor turning into a lead or a free trial turning into an actual custom as to how well is before. And it's really...

...interesting that simply by asking them to draw the diagram, many times they come up with breakthrough as themselves and they think they know what the diagram is in their heads and everybody thinks they're all on the same page about what their funnel is. But when there's several people in the room you get a lot of debate and discussion taking place about what actually is the funnel and they don't know what it is. And nearly by writing it down they suddenly start coming up with creative ideas. So if I just gave one idea alone on this this podcast for you, would be take the time to document what you think your bias journey looks like and also what you think your funnel looks like, and you will be amazed at how you're going to get creative breakthroughs on that. I then, when I've got that diagram out there, I tend to focus in on where it looks like they've got a conversion problem, where's that blockage point in the funnel, and I'll try to help solve that for them. And I've got a particular way of doing this and it is I like to look at both the friction around that step, how much work is there for...

...the customer to go through that step and secondly, what concerns might they have? So an example of this is when you ask somebody to give you their email address, they actually have a lot of concerns about that. They're fed up with spam and they don't want to be spammed by yet another company that's that you know it's constantly got a badge of them and fill their email in box up. So there's there's there's a lot of concerns that you have to address and you can do one of two things. You can either redesign that step and change it so that it's it doesn't have those concerns, or if you can't redesign it, you have to come up with a motivation that is strong enough to pull them through their their concerns and answer there as many of their concerned as possible will pull them through the friction that they've got to go through with something that's a motivational tool. So I'll give you a little example of this. At Jay boss, we wanted to get people's email addresses and when we try to get it, they conversion rate for them doing a download of the product just dropped to literally a tenth of what it was before we ask for the another address. So we realize we needed an incentive and what we did was we took the documentation that they were able to download for free...

...and put that as the incentive that they would get if they gave us the email address, and that actually looted inner an amazing tenzero leaves flow per month of email addresses that we got. After that, you invented gated content. Yeah, he's way back when and before that concept with around as well. So yeah, you're exactly right. So then you know, I'll give you a couple of other examples of some fun things that I like to work on. So if you have a free trial, I focus in deeply on the time to wow, and what I mean by wise. I like have two definitions of the wild moment. One of them is a mini wow, which is where, as somebody's going through your free trial, they see something cool that motivates them to continue and get to get them a bit excited. But the big while, the real major wow, is when is your product proven to them that it actually solves their business problem and skives them sufficient confidence that they can now go ahead and buy it without any risk associated with it.

And I think a lot of companies don't know that and haven't thought about that, and it can sometimes be different for different buyers going, you know, going through a particular product. Some briers might have come to see that they this kind of wil moment. Others might have come to see a different woman. And then I like to work with them on how many steps, how much friction is there to get to whole and can we remove steps? Can we remove friction? And I'll give you a tiny little example here. I think a lot of your customers are probably familiar with a company called clear bit. Do you know clear but yourself? So, yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah. So they enrich sales forth data. So I sat down with Alex mccaor, who's a CEO, and I did is exact exercise with him and we got to a part of their free trial where they have to prove to their buyer that the quality of the data that they had is better than the quality that they've seen with other products, similar products that are being around in the past. And the second thing they have to prove is that they've got enough a good coverage of the database that this particular company might have. So if you only got five percent coverage in clear bit, that's not...

...going to be those valuable as if you've got to say, sixty seventy percent coverage, and the only way they could do that was to get this clear bit connected to Seales Forcecom. And when they try to do that, they had a lot of issues because they had to go and get it to sign off on providing clear but with the interface to get it to sales force. And so the redesign that I came up with for them was to put a chrome plug in in place so that the end user who is sitting there, who's generally frequently open to the notion of just putting in a chrome plug in this and feel like a big security risk atour is now able to have their seals force page completely redesigned in the browser so that you can see what clear bit does for your prospects as you're actually looking at sales for and you literally get to see the page that way it would look if you were a paying customer, and you're able to also bring up a report of, say, a thousand customers and see what kind of coverage they have. So you get to evaluate the quality of their data and you get to evaluate the coverage that they have. And it turns out that that, you know, that simple...

...redesign of that step there, which really looked at the buyers friction and how we might change, redesign the step to get rid of that friction, was just very, very successful for them. Then became one of the key parts of their whole free trial and lead flow process there and that I have so many other stories that, you know, redesigns around this notion, that the simple notion here is I found myself to be, accidentally, very good at thinking about how the buyer was going to react to the way you wanted them to go through your sales process and then figuring out ways to, you know, Elis at the art of selling. Here, redesign the things that you could get rid of, the problems that we're going to annoither buyer or actually make it much easier for them to get to where you needed them to get to. So hopefully that that line of thinking is something that can be helpful. And again, my my advice to anybody listening to this here is number one, draw this diagram of what you think your buyers journey looks like, draw the Diagram of what you think your funnel looks like. Hone in on...

...where your greatest funnel blockage point is and bring a team together. The team that you want is should have representatives from these sales organization, the Marketing Organization for tick. It important to have the product organization in there and also customer success and have those folks focus on how do they optimize the conversion rates of your final and if you can optimize a conversion rates, you can double conversion out of your phonels. You can double the amount of bookings your business is bringing. So it's an extremely fun and worthwhile exercise for the company. It's incredibly valuable. Thank you so much for for breaking that down for us. I know it's going to be very, very impactful for a lot of the folks that are listening. David, thanks so much for being on the show this week. Remind US one more time. If people want to reach out to you, what's the best way to do that? Yes, a first first let me recommend that if they're interested in what I've been talking about, I have this great video series up on my blog under the zero, two, one hundred event that I held. But if they still don't find what they're looking for, I love toyto entrepreneurs when I have the time and would...

...suggest that they email me at de Scock Dskoka at Matrix Partnerscom and I will try to replies as many times as I can do for those wonderful David, thanks so much for being on the show. If you're out there listening and you want to get in touch with me, it's Sam Jacobs. You can find me on Linkedin, Linkedincom, forward the word in and then forwards last time. F Jacobs, and thanks so much to our sponsor, outreach, for providing the support and the ability to house this podcast in the first place. David, thanks so much and I'll talk to everybody else next time.

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