The Sales Hacker Podcast
The Sales Hacker Podcast

Episode · 2 months ago

198: A 5-Part Framework for Designing Your Best Life

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode of the Sales Hacker Podcast, we have Russell Benaroya, Co-Founder and Partner at Stride and author of One Life to Lead, a book he wrote to help others with life design after he transformed his own. Join us for a candid conversation about taking charge of your life and becoming your best self.

What You’ll Learn

  1. If you’re in a bad place in your life, you can take control
  2. Pay attention to facts, not stories
  3. Identify what your guiding principles are
  4. How to overcome your fear of change  

Show Agenda and Timestamps

  1. About Russell Benaroya & Stride[2:07]
  2. How Russell changed his life & moved to Costa Rica [7:21]
  3. 5-part framework for life design [10:40]
  4. 4 ways to modernize talent acquisition [22:26]
  5. Facing your fear of change decisions [18:01]
  6. Russell on the Great Resignation [22:04]
  7. Paying it forward [25:44]
  8. Sam’s Corner [28:21]

High team. It's Sam Jacobs. You're listening to the salesacker podcast. We've got a great show for you today. We've got Russell Benaroya. Russell is the author of a book called one life to lead. I have read that book. We brought Russell in to speak to our CEO Pavilion. It's a we're building a CEO pavilion for people that are CEOS, and Russell to a whole workshop on how to structure and design your life in the right way so that you live with purpose and intention. It's a great book. He's a great guy. He also runs stride services, which is the company that is providing all of the bookkeeping services from my company, Pavilion. So I think it's a great conversation. It's an inspire and conversation and and maybe it will inspire you in some way. Now, before we get there, we want to thank our sponsors. We have three. The first is pavilion. Pavilion is the key to getting more out of your career. Our private membership connects you with a network of thousands of like minded peers and resources where you can tap into dozens of leadership opportunities, classes and training through Pavilion University, in Roll in sales school, Sales Development School, marketing school and many, many more for yourself or for your entire team. We've got a new sponsor on the show this month. That sponsor is mine, tickle. Let's tell you about mind tackle a little bit. Do only a few reps meet quota each quarter? Is the majority of your revenue driven by a few top performers? You know that doesn't have to be the case. Revenue Leaders Trust mind tackle to identify and drive winning sales reps behaviors so you can meet and beat quota every quarter. Go to try debtmind, tickledcom forward sales hacker to learn more. That you are all again is try dot mind, ticklecom forwards, lash sales hacker or and finally, outreach. outreaches the first and only engagement and intelligence platform built by revenue innovators for revenue innovators. Outreach allows you to commit to accurate sales forecasting. We're placing manual processes with real time guidance and unlocking actionable customer intelligence that guides you and your team to win more often. Find out why outreach is the right solution for you at Click Dot outreach, Dot ioh forwards, thirty MPC. That you are all again is clickt outreached, out io forward, slash thirty MPC. And let's listen my conversation with Russell. Hey, everybody, it's Sam Jacobs. Welcome to the sales hacker podcast. Today on the show we're excited to welcome Russell, then Arroya. Russell is an author, entrepreneur and speaker focused on helping people achieve their highest and best use by staying in their genius zones. Russell spent the last twenty years an investment banking, private equity and Entrepreneurship and today's the cofounder of stride services, and outsource accounting and strategic finance firm that helps business owners use their data for better decision making. Russell speaks on topics designed to help business leaders build more successful businesses through a combination of selfdiscovery and tactical financial tools, and he's recently written a book that I've just finished reading called one life to lead, and we are going to talk all about that book because it's a really fantastic book on laying out a series of design steps to help you, as the...

...listener, better design the life you want to create. So, Russell, welcome to the show, SAM, so great to be here. Great intro. Thanks, you're welcome. Thanks for being here. So we like to start with your baseball card, which is a way typically, typically the person that we're interviewing only does one thing, but you do a few things. So let's give you an opportunity to tell us about this those few things. So, first of all, pavilion, the company that I run, as you know, is a customer of stride services. Tell us what is stride services so that we can understand what your day job is. Yeah, so, at the highest level, stride is in the business of helping people with a thirst for continuous improvement achieve their highest and best use. We happen to do that through helping clients manage their bookkeeping, accounting and strategic financials, basically helping entrepreneurs stay focused on their zone of genius, which is growth and sales and strategy, while we take over that Daytoday Back Office distraction around invoicing a pain bills and pay roll, and that's a real purposeful business for us, because CEO's only have so much time in the day and this is not where we want them spending time. Couldn't agree more. And and certainly for my company, stride has helped, has helped us take leaps and bounds and great strides in terms of our ability to focus on what matters and delegate the things that we're not so good at, like accounting, which you're better at. So thank you for your support. Now, the other thing you've done is written a book called one life to lead, and the story of stride and the story of one life to lead her are inevitably intertwined. But tell us about the book and then, and I think that's really a great conversation, to a starting point. Yeah, the the title of the book, as you shared, as one life to lead business success through better life design, and it was really this realization for me that how you lead your life is how you lead your business. And as I started writing the book when my family and I were living in Costa Rica about two and a half years ago, it was an opportunity for me to step back and observe all of my patterns and behaviors that I had brought into the businesses that I had owned and run over several years and said, Huh boy, that was really dysfunctional behavior. Or Oh, I see why that problem or arose because of maybe how I approached trying to solve it in the first place. And for me it was really an opportunity to reflect on how what I bring to my business is sometimes very helpful and sometimes not very helpful. But we're so in the weeds that it's hard for us to step back and make that observation. And I had the gift of being in Costa Rica, which was a career, which was a life trajectory change for my family and I to start writing. And when I started writing I was like, yeah, I do have a story here, but only one person wants to buy that book, which is me, because it's not really about me, it's really about all entrepreneurs face this...

...question around how does this thing that I'm building to try to change the world, how is this driving the life that I'm trying to design an architect? And sometimes before we know it we're like, wait a second, it's not and I feel captive and I'm not able to step back and look at the bigger picture. So that's you know, I think a lot of people do feel like that. I don't think it's just CEOS or founders. I think a lot of people feel trapped by circumstance and don't feel like they're in full control of the outputs that their life is generating. So maybe let's start just briefly. You're a little bit more about your background, how you wound up in Costa Rica, and then we let's dive into the framework that you've designed through one life to lead. But how do we get to Costa Rica in the first place and how did we find our way there? In Russell's journey and what steps led you there, I tracked a very textbook path through Undergrad and then investment banking and then private equity and then business school and start up and like really making my Jewish parents super proud of Russell, like yes, he's checking the boxes on all of these great things, but there was something missing for me and my life, which was a true desire to take a leap and build something on my own and be an entrepreneur and create. And I come from a family of entrepreneurs and I thought to myself, how can I be somebody who opines on what business is to invest in if I haven't really run a business myself? And so, in two thousand and four I took the leap of Entrepreneurship and started at Healthcare Company, and that was a journey of five years. We sold that company and I subsequently started another healthcare technology related business, and you I mean that's it was a lot of ups and downs to build those businesses and raise capital and hire people and ultimately exit those exit those businesses. I was feeling pretty exhausted, but not nearly as exhausted as my wife or not nearly as exhausted as my family. And there was a moment in two thousand and Sixteen Sam where we were driving back from this ski trip and this is this is the opening scene of the book. If I'm not mistaken, it is. Yeah, I mean just pictured this like snow storm, white flurry everywhere. Listening to that Tony Robins podcast, I'm sure many of your listeners listen to a Tony Robbins here and there, and it was called three steps to the break, a breakthrough, and I'm really fired up and my wife's probably rolling her eyes. Her name is Melissa. And he said something that prompted me to turn down the dial and I looked at her and I said Yeah, Melissa, why haven't we ever talked about where we want to be in five to ten years, and she said, well, it's never really been about us, it's always been about you...

...and you're an entrepreneur and you're often doing these things and we're kind of along for the ride. And I don't want to dramatize that moment, but it was really a moment where I finally was able to observe that my actions and behaviors and decisions had an impact much greater than myself. And that was the beginning of a journey that my wife and I went on together to say, Hey, what are we trying to build? What matters, what's important to us, and then how does the business you engage in map to what we say is important in what we're trying to achieve? And ultimately, the decision that we took to move our family to Costa Rica and our kids were in school. I had one child in high school and one in middle school. We moved to the capital of Costa Rica and San Jose. We'd lived in an urban environment. We we just lived was because my wife and I've been talking for twelve years about would it be great if we created an abroad experience for our kids. But like gets in the way and you can't do you know, you're like you found all these reasons to not do these things, until we had some friends that just kept pushing us to say go do it, like, see what happens, take the leap and, as scared as we were to jump into the unknown, it's simultaneously opened up a universe of possibility and opportunity in abundance, where I was like, wow, this is a big world. Wow, I am an architect of the life that I want to design. Why have I been feeling like I'm in like this cage, that have to prove something to other people what really matters? And that was a sea change of philosophy and how I wanted to live. So you move to Costa Rica. You you had this idea for the book. Tell us. Will first tell us what the framework is, because there's a series of very specific, you know, milestones and steps that that we should take if we are to embrace the concept of, you know, being the architect of our own life and embracing the ideas in one life to lead. So let's start there. What tell us about how you came up with this this framework, and tell us what the framework is. I remember this moment when I started writing, sitting at a cafe in in San Jose, and it was just this outpouring of emotion that I had just packed in and bottled up and ignored for many, many years, and I just, like stream of consciousness, started writing about this moment, in that moment, in this experience, in this feeling, and as I wrote, some patterns began to emerge and I was curious about these patterns and the reason why the book is punctuated with Vignettes from other individuals that I call life designers. These are other business leaders around the United States that have been willing to take off their armor for the purpose of this book to share their experience around managing that life design with...

...business leadership. The patterns that emerged were the following. So the first pattern was that I spent a lot of time telling stories that weren't grounded in fact. So that's number one, grounding stories with facts. And when I say that, what I mean is we're crazy. We're crazy people. We spend so much time in our head talking about a future that has yet to unfold. So we make up so much about what is going to happen or not going to happen or what could happen, or we spend a lot of time talking about the past and what should have happened and we didn't do. But none of that is really grounded and like what are the facts? What are the facts? And are usually aren't that many facts, but we spend a lot of time and stories, awareness of your stories that don't serve you. Number One. Number two is establishing your principles. When you don't have principles or a code that you use to make decisions independent of the circumstance, like what is your code, your non set of nonnegotiables, then you become subject to other people's principles or subject to the moment where you're like, I'm not really sure what I should do. Should I do that deal or not do that deal? Well, like it's not grounded in anything that is foundational to how you define yourself as a being. That's number two. Number three was I spent a lot of time around people that didn't give me energy. They just drained my energy and I could never really put a finger on the words, but I was like, yet I want to spend time where I get energy, because I only have a hundred points of energy to use during a day. So I'd rather spend those hundred points on growth and expansion then on trying to recover from energy drains or what we call entropy. Number four is get and stay in your genius zone. We probably spend maybe ten percent of our time in that zone of genius, that place where we lose track of time, where we're in that state of flow, where people acknowledge us for being so amazing at that work, but we never really thought too much about it. We're just like really good at it. But if we're out of our genius zone, like, that's not highest and best purpose, that's not highest and best use. And then the last one, and maybe the most important, is you only learn when you take action, when you take that leap into the unknown with the courage to know that you will figure it out and you can do all this work, all this self awareness, but if you're not willing to execute, if you're not willing to act, if you're not willing to experiment, you'll never move forward in architecting your life because you're not building on a foundation from which you can construct what it is you're ultimately trying to accomplish. So those are the five areas of life design, and it's more of a guide than it as a oh I figured it out,...

...now you could go and do it too. It's not like that. We're always engaging in crazy self talk, and so the book is a bit of a resource to go back to when you're feeling drawn back into that cycle of self limiting beliefs. Everything you say. You know, it's interesting. These ideas are interesting because they are found in Tony Robins and they are found in Napoleon hill and we all discover them anew for ourselves. And yet that doesn't make them any less true. They're always true, which is that so much of our life is about the stories that we tell ourselves, which we choose, and we can choose to tell ourselves positive stories or negative stories. They're completely arbitrary. It's completely up to us, and and so much more of our life is under our control, and then sometimes than we think. Now, the second step you mentioned is will figure out what your principles are. How did you figure out what your principles were, and are they controversial in anyway? Do you do you think that you have certain principles that other people don't, or how do you approach. I guess that that's a process that's not obvious to me, figuring out like what you believe and what you stand for and what your principles are. How did you do it? I started thinking about moments where I felt like I compromised my principles, and that feeling of compromising your principles, otherwise stated, is to be out of integrity with yourself. Out of integrity with yourself is the following when what you say, when what you say is different than what you're thinking, is different than what you're feeling in your gut. You know those moments, Sam, when you're like, Dang, I do not feel great about this situation. It could be a it could be a partnership, it could be a deal, right, it could be a sale, it could be a relationship, when you're like that doesn't feel good, but I'm gonna just go with it and figure it out later and it'll work out. And does it ever work out? Very rarely. Never Work Yeah, very rarely, fair enough, very rarely works out. So I thought about these moments where I compromise my principles and said, how would I have wanted to be in those circumstances where I could have reflected on my principles and said, Oh, I'm pretty clear on the decision that I'm going to make because of this code that I have created. So, for example, I have a principle which is I speak up when my feelings are in conflict with my thoughts and actions. And for me it's a little principles can be a little aspirational, but if this is part of my code and the muscle that I want to build in flex that when I am inconsistent with what I'm saying versus how I'm feeling, I have a principle that says I speak up, and now I work to embed that into, like the systems of our business. So it's a little bit more structured,...

...but that's that. That's a good place to start in the exercise makes a lot of sense. One of the things that people listen you know, these kinds of you can call themselves help. It doesn't I don't. I don't detach any pejorative value to that. This is not a negative statements, just a fact that this is about helping yourself. And they're still overwhelmed by fear. And so when your last step you say you will take action, you can imagine a lot of people saying, well, it's very it's very easy for you to say take action, Russell, but I'm not in a position where I'm capable of taking action. And yet, to the point of moving to Costa Rica, it's very easy for you to make the argument that you weren't in a position to take action either, and yet you did so. How do people give tips or helpful instruction or guidance or advice for people that feet they just have that wall of fear in front of this decision that they know in their hearts they want to take, but they just don't have the courage to take it. What do you tell those people? How do you coach those people? Break it down in terms of experiments? Oftentimes that fear is because we place permanence to the decision, as if we cannot recover from it, as if we cannot back out from it. Very few decisions that we make are unrecoverable or permanent decisions, and those decisions we should be, like, very, very careful and thoughtful about. But ninety percent of decisions are recoverable, and so if you think about the decisions that you make in terms of I'm going to run this experiment right, like the decision to move to Costa Rica. Wasn't because I had some amazing financial exit and I was going on some sabbatical. I assure you that was not it. The experiment was this. Rather than thinking of this trajectory change as a expense, I'm going to reframe it as an investment. I could invest in places. I'm going to think of as an investment. I'm willing to make this investment. I'm time boxing the experience. Who knows what's going to happen, but it's not permanent. Now, that was a pretty big move for us, a pretty big decision, but you have a lot of decisions that you choose not to pursue because you're scared. Scared as awesome, by the way, because it's a junction for either retreating in fear or having the courage to move forward. So I'm scared, but the courage to move forward is a willingness to frame the decision as an experiment, with a curiosity and a learning to what comes next. And what comes next, by the way, is more learning and more curiosity, and then you can choose if you want to keep taking that next step. Break it down, break it down. We will, we will break it. Yeah, all right, wrong podcast are now. It's okay, I'm you're going somewhere. I mean keep going, brother. I feel like you're about to break into some freestyle rap, and that's cool. I support it. What. Well, you know what, you know...

...what I think this is actually maps to one of my my principles, which is when I when I feel Inclinde, I dance without him, with I dance without apology. Yeah, I remember that and I I can dance without apology often times, but I cannot dance without criticism because that comes from external parties, including my way as much. Sometimes I dance and she says stop dancing. I dance alone, where nobody can see me, without apology exactly. We're almost at the end of our time together. But you know, we have this sheet that people fill out before they before they hop on, and you we have this question. What's something you have a uniquer controversial perspective on, and I this actually is a very unique or controversial perspective, so I want to ask you about it. One of the thing, you know, we're in the middle of this massive, massive talent shortage where, you know, I have a number of stats I can reel off. My friend Osids Amon, who runs sales talent agency in Canada, says there are eleven thousand more sales job openings. Then there are sales people in high growth markets, in the top ten markets, to fill those. Heard another staff that there are point seven candidates for every job opening out there in the United States, again meeting like we are under under employed by thirty percent, you know, like we have way more jobs than there are people that seem interested in taking those jobs. And this there's this phrase that's happened during the pandemic called the great resignation, where people are quitting their jobs, sometimes because, you know, sometimes without another job. Maybe some of them are jump embracing fear and taking courage and start a business. Some of them are but you've said that you have a contrap controversial perspective on this. Tell me what you think about you know what the great resignation means in terms of the individuals out there that are that are that are quitting or moving on. The statement that I expressed was that the great resignation is driven by individuals that aren't willing to take their hundred percent responsibility, and what I mean by that, Sam is, whenever you arrive at an outcome that is a suboptimal outcome, like, Oh, I'm not happy in my current role, and there are two parties at the table right in this case your employer and you're an employee, to just stop for a second and say, I'm here in this moment because I was unconsciously committed to getting this outcome. I was unconsciously committed to being in this place, meaning I have a role to play, to find myself in this circumstance, this feeling that I have about my current situation that is seemingly untenable and I'm going to leave. And what I would challenge people to think about is that, before you villainize your employer or before you play the I am a victim, like Oh, they did this to me, and before you go to that next job, which may in fact repeat itself, because there's only one constant in these two scenarios, which is you acknowledge for a second your role or your responsibility and having cre aided the dynamic that forced you to...

...have to leave this job situation, for example, did you have candor or did you withhold your feelings about your current situation? Did you express your challenges or struggles? Did you try to understand and be curious about why things were happening in the organization that you didn't see as being particularly valuable to helping you get your job done? And so I just want to encourage before you go leap into another circumstance where you may flip out again right in the next couple of years, use it as a gift for what it is here to teach you. Well, I those are wise words and I agree with you. I completely agree with you, and only in the sense that, again, like I think, a theme is a lot. You know, if an asteroid hits the Earth, agreed, that's not our fault. You didn't do that. Most of the things in your life are the are the result of actions that you have taken and we have way more control. It's not universally true, and there are tragedies out there in the world, but most of the circumstances that you find yourself in are the result of things that you have done and you can do things to change those circumstances in ways that sometimes you don't ascribe your own agency or power to so. And if you have an employer who also subscribes to that. A similar for Blosophy, where they're willing to take their hundred percent responsibility for the circumstance and you're willing to take your hundred percent responsibility, then you've got two hundred percent of possibility to find common ground, and that is a great cultural dynamic that doesn't exist everywhere. Of course. Absolutely, Russell, we're just about at the end of our time together, but the thing we like to do is pay it forward a little bit and give you an opportunity to talk about people, ideas, books that you think are inspirational that helped you get where you where you are today. So if you if there are things, people, ideas, books that you think we should be aware of that have had a being impact on you, what comes to mind? There's a book that is fundamentally changed how I think about building a business and how I think about relationships, and it's called fifteen commitments of conscious leadership by Jim deathmer and Diana Chapman. Just a phenomenal guide for this movement afoot called conscious leadership, and there's certainly some aspects in one life to lead that reflect that. I'd highly, highly recommend that book. And anybody that is in a position on your podcast to introduce that into their organizations. I would highly, highly recommend it. I also, for whatever reason, you know, I like to run you and I have spoken about running, probably not as at much length as I want to with you. We will, I listen to believe me, not as much length as I want to either. So Fair enough. I listen to this the this podcast...

...by Eckhart tole a called essential teachings and he wrote a book called a new earth and the power of now, and what I really appreciate about his podcast, even though I play it on like one point five acts because he's pretty slow and how he speaks is is that he really really helps you appreciate the only thing that you know is what is happening right now, the present moment, and the present moment changes all the time. All you can do is live in the present and when you're out on a trail in the middle of nowhere, those words stick and they're pretty effective. Well, I love that and I want to be out in the trail in the middle of nowhere, maybe, maybe with you guiding me by my side, maintaining my heart rate under one hundred and thirty five. We will see Russell. It's been great having me on the show. We're going to talk to you on Friday for Friday fundamentals. So, but, but, by the way, if folks want to reach out to you, what's the best way to get in touch? Oh, best best way to get in touch is either check out www dot stride dot services. So you can find me there. You can also send me an email at Russell to ss two els at Ben a Roya dotnet. I'm linked on Linkedin Russell Ben Roya or twitter at our Ben Roya. Awesome Russell. Will Talk to you on Friday for Friday fundamentals. So much fun, Sam. Thank you, you're doing great work. You too, buddy. All right, hi everybody. Sam's corner really enjoyed that conversation with Russell Ben a Roya. If you have been about his book, buy his book. One life to lead, one life to lead, all about, as we mentioned in the show, in the interview that we just did, how he he was in a bad place and he took control of his life and he walked through an entire process and framework for how to do that. And there's a bunch of things that resonate with me personally. The first two are perhaps most resonant. You'll hear these lessons, you know, you'll hear these lessons from all kinds of different self help gurus, influencers, human beings. A lot of people derive these conclusions independently and on their own, and sometimes you'll hear something from Tony Robbins and it won't land just the right way, but you'll hear it from Russell Ben Roya and it will land just the right way. You hear from me, or you hear it from somebody else, or you hear it from yourself, because you will derive the same conclusions. But one of the things that you'll find in your life is that we tell ourselves stories all the time. Our whole world is a construction of a narrative that, as a point of fact, doesn't actually exist. That it's it is created in our mind, probably as a result of evolution, to help us navigate the world more effectively so that maybe we can procreate and recreate ourselves, and maybe it gives us the ambition and the motivation to do so, which perhaps is an evolutionary trait. I don't know. But the point is that these stories were often not super useful, especially when they are about interpersonal relationships and the stories about how somebody did something and the reason that they did this thing is because they're trying to get you or they're out to get you, is often a complete construct action, of fabrication in your own mind.

And so the way that you begin, the way that you begin to solve that, and you may have heard this in therapy or heard other people talk about it, is you talk about how you feel, and it's not I'm angry because you are a jerk or an asshole. That's not really what we mean. You might want to go one layer deeper. I feel sad, I feel frustrated. I feel frustrated that this happened, and whatever this happened is, it is a statement of fact. It isn't that you were rude. That's an opinion. That you walked aggressively, briskly into the front door in that way and didn't hold it open for me. That's probably closer to a fact. But instead of saying you made me mad, which as a technical point of fact, isn't actually possible, since you are in control of your emotions, and saying you made me mad as a way of outsourcing agency of your own life to third parties. I feel mad, I am angry, I am frustrated, just a really interesting part of it. That's the very first thing, right. Facts, not stories. And if you want to tell yourself a story, because again it is completely arbiture, you are allowed to tell yourself whatever story you want. You might be swimming in a garbage dumpster right now and you might be happy as a clam because you're telling yourself a story that that is the best place. There's a lot of good food, a lot of people throw away bad food and maybe that's a good place to eat it. And I'm not saying, and this is not a this is the point of that story. Is Not a condemnation of any kind of person. It is more a statement of your perspective. Is Up to you. You can tell yourself whatever story you want to tell yourself. And there are people that come out of tragic situations and they are optimistic and they feel grateful that they came out of those tragic situations. And there are people that stubb their toe or get a nasty email or, you know, nobody gives them enough emojis in their slack message at work. And it ruins their day. Frankly, sometimes I'm one of those people. This isn't about being perfect. This is about having tools that you can refer back to when you're having a difficult time. So you know, if that means something to you, I hope so. If it doesn't, that's okay. They'll be another episode on Friday and then another episode the week after that. So there's always something, something for you. If if you feel like you're not being stated by the content, the content that is created and we all have to enthrall and we all work at the behest of content itself. As we heard an as he's in Sari's netflix special. That was recently on. Now, at any rate, it's time to go. Before we go, we want to ask you. Have you joined the sales hacker community yet? You're missing out if you haven't. Any said anybody can join. It's free. You can ask questions, you can get answers, you can share experiences. There's more than seventeen thousand sales professionals. I'm sure it's well over Twenty Five Tho, given we haven't updated this copy in a little bit, so please go do that. We also, of course, want to thank our three sponsors. The first company we want to thank is pavilion. If you haven't taken a look at some of the courses that they're putting out, we are putting out, let's be honest, do do that. We have this amazing new VP of learning, her name is Rachel coblets, and we've got we've got schools and courses and workshops rolling out through the middle of the year and on into the back after the year on everything from sort of SASS fundamentals, like...

...how do you know the things to talk about when it comes to Sass, to traditional curriculum like sales school, Sales Development School, marketing school. It's useful for you and it's also useful for your entire team. We also really want to thank flock Ja. Now, with sales becoming increasingly knowledge driven and digital first, elite sales leaders are looking for ways to invest in the most important part of their text deck, which is their people. Flock Jay helps sales teams from five to five thousand do their best work by automatically capturing, tagging and sharing best practice is wherever they are, which is so critically important. Go to flock Jaycom for sales. Heck, if you find yourself. You're always looking for the answer. There's fifty different documents. Flock Day might be able to help their great company. Finally, outreach, the first and only engagement and intelligence platform built by revenue innovators for revenue innovators. Traditional tools simply don't work in a hybrid sales world. Find out why. outreaches the right solution at click dot outreach dot io forward thirty MPC. If you'd like to reach out to me, you can for any reason at all. You want to have a career coaching conversation, I'm happy to do it. Email me Sam at Joint Pavilioncom put career coaching one on one in the subject and we will set it up. And I have no idea who you are. If you try to tell me something, that's up to you, but let's try, let's figure it out, let's see if anybody's out there and listening. Otherwise, otherwise, give us five stars in the APP stores and the podcast places and we'll talk to you next time.

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