The Sales Hacker Podcast
The Sales Hacker Podcast

Episode · 2 months ago

172. How to Build Out Your Up Market Strategy w/ Ryan Staley


In this episode of the Sales Hacker Podcast, we have repeat guest Ryan Staley, CEO at Whale Boss and fellow podcast host at Sales and Marketing Built Freedom. Join us for a great conversation about why you don’t have to boil the ocean when moving upmarket and the best ways to position your company for enterprise sales success.

What You’ll Learn

  1. Framing the economic impact of moving upmarket
  2. Why companies should verticalize
  3. Building an enterprise sales motion gradually
  4. Strategies for raising money… or not

Show Agenda and Timestamps

  1. Ryan Staley & Whale Scale [3:15]
  2. Your biggest enterprise sales mistake [7:23]
  3. Implementing a winning deals-tracking system [14:30]
  4. Why your org doesn’t need funding [18:26]
  5. Paying it forward: shout-outs [28:55]
  6. Sam’s Corner [32:46] 

One two one: Three: Three: Everybody,Sam Jacobs, welcome to the Sales Saker podcast. We got a great show for youtoday. We've got an interview with Ryan's Daily Enterprise sales expertand somebody that really can teach people how to grow and skill. Yourcompany from an Enterprise Ales perspective, so we're super excitedabout it. Before we get there. We want to think our sponsors. We've got threefor the show versus out reach art, which has been a long time sponsor.This podcast were excited to announce that their annual road show series.Only summit series is back in person. This fall in Austin, Chicago SanFrancisco, New York City in London. This year theme is the rise of revenue.Innovators join a new cohort of revenue leaders who are transforming the worldof buying and selling by arming their sellers with a single, unifiedengagement and intelligence platform, get more details and saviour spot atsummit that out reached a Ao were also brought you by pavilion. Pavilion isthe Kiti getting more out of your career. Take any one of our overfifteen different schools, including sales acceleration school for SDRs,chief Revenue Officer, School Chief Marketing Officer School and the newlyannounced chief Customer Officer School for whatever your career track isthere's a school for you within Padilla Unlock your professional potential atJoint Pavilion Com and, finally, blue board cash for words. They feel like aslap in the face. Don't they that's why you got to check out blue boardsincredible company? They provide experiential sales incentives andpresidents club trips. It's the world's leading experiential sales recognitionplatform offering top wraps your choice of hand, created experiences from sky,diving to court side, tickets, Michell and star dining at places like Frenchlaundry to five starts spot escapes. Do you need that that wonderful kind ofreeky, massage or maybe a deep Swedish tissue massage you can get that throughblue ward for pleasants, clad blue board offers individual baculus tripsand luxury home gods from Paletan bikes to swimming with whale sharks and CaboYoga retreats and Bale to chasing the northern lights, treat our ups like theRock Stars. They are, after they pick their favorite experience. This is oneof the best parts. It's not just that you pick this experience. It's that youget a conser, so you get a dedicated blue board CONSECUTA plan all of yourlogistics in Itinary, so you don't have to lift a single finger check him out.PODCAST DOT bluebook get your free dem out now, let's Lissen my conversationwith Ryan's Daily everybody at Sam Jacob's. Welcome tothe Sales Hacker podcast today on the show. We've got Ryan Daley. Let me tellyou about Ryan he's the founder and CEO of a consulting company called whaleboss in two thousand. He had his first success in businesses, an inside sales,rap selling, cutting edge technology and training to CIOS C tos and VPS ofthe largest investment banks and brokerages in the world. After two anda half years, he shifted to a complex sales position for a privately held,manage services provider that had no customers in Chicago. That's whereRyan's from eventually becoming a multiyear president's club, winner andequity holder, that Experience Launch Ryan to leadership position in whichwas responsible for transforming struggling business unit into the topperforming office, creating an enterprise team from scratch anddeveloping a recurring revenue engine. So now he is running whale boss, he'san expert in a price sales he's also...

...the Chicago Chapter Head for Pavilion,which is, as everybody knows. I think at this point the company that I runBrian were excited to have you on the show. Welcome to the show I am pup manis, you know, I love Pavilion and I love sale factor. So this is an OOimachine in heaven. It's amazing yeah. That's I'm excited to be on the show.You've had a lot of great guests on so well. You just won one more great guessso I mentioned whale boss, but let's give you an opportunity, tell us whatis whale boss do give us this business that you run in that you started andrun sure man. So basically the name is kind of created or crafted, because wegrew an enterprise team from zero to thirty million in and reace revenue atmy last company, when I was kind of tasted to create an enterprise salesmotion from scratch, everything from the playbooks to the team and so how wekind of survived due to intense pressure from our CEO and investors,was to constantly scale up and continue to Brenon Wales. So right now, what Ido is I help text startups or you know, mature TEC companies basically scaleand expand their revenue through what I call a revenue sprint, which is a threemonth, consulting engagement so that they can implement a seven or eightfigure sales system via three different methods that I've kind of coined andthat we're the first principles behind that revenue grows strategy. So that'swhat I'm doing right now I love it. I love working with CEOS, it's so muchfun and they like to make like to make shithappen in a really fast manner, and that aligns well with me. So yeah man,that's that's what I've been doing, how long you been doing it. So I made theshift. Officially. I've been a business for a year. I made the shift to startworking in the more directly with CEOS about six months ago, so yeah awesome.Well, let mean let's dive in because I is you know this is a topic entouresales that T. I think a lot of people are interested in so first, you know,let's give you an opportunity. What are the is it? A three step motion. Is thatwhat you said, there's basically kind of three different tracks and in Samthe way I look at him at is it's like all these tech companies a lot of thesetech companies? I should say not all of them right that I want to speak inabsolutes, but the majority of tech companies that you see out therethey're either founded by a technical person that has a large influence or asales driven marking driven personality and a lot of times they're founder, ledin terms of sales until they get to a certain point. Now a lot of the folks.I work with are not invested in by VC. I believe that there's a massiveopportunity in the market to help people grow at an expension ratewithout taking on funding and there's a time in a place for funding, and itworks well as well. However, there's a big need, because right now, a lot ofthe folks that I talk to think that that's the only way, and so what I looked at is I'm like.Okay, I keep hearing this feedback...

...there's these tech companies arefocused on the operating system of their software or the operating systemof their company veather software, their tack, but they don't have a salesoperating system, and so when I look at that, there's three main components andwhat I call is it's a whale scale operating system, it's a secondarysales operating system and it's referrals for revenue operating system.Those are the three main components that allow a company to scale massivelyin a short period of time as long as they're implemented correctly. So we'lltalk about the whale scale system, I'm interested in that one I mean I'minterested in all of them, but I guess you know the fundamental question underpenning. All of this is so many companies want to quote unquote, movein to the enterprise, but don't understand quite what's necessary, soin your opinion, may be thinking about the whale scale system as one of theexamples. What is the path, and what do you see? What do you think the biggestmistake companies make when they're trying to do enterprise sales yeah? SoI can start off with that. I'll start off with the mistake. First then, andthen I could kind of talk through the path. That's cool! Is that sound goodyeah? It sounds great all right man, so one of the biggest mistakes that I seeis a lot of companies think that they have to go and hire a big chunk ofpeople right off the bat to quote unquote, move up market or move intothe enterprise, and so when I went through this process, I had folks and Ihad to be extremely resourceful because I didn't have a big budget for hiring,and so I had a continually scale up in a reasonable manner without going outand hiring four or five really really talented experience people, because thefolks I work with head zero experience, and so the method to do that is tobasically look at your best customers right in terms of size and in terms ofprofitability, because, let's face it SAM, if they're, really big customers,but they take up ninety percent your time and the profit billy sucks. Youdon't want to replicate those right, and so what I do is look at that andthen really have a design focus in strategyaround continuing to expand and multiply your best customers. When Isay best, custome or CP, I mean your top five, your top ten customers, andif you do that, a lot of times you could double the size of those topcustomers is laws is a focused strategy for the company and in your prospecting,customer profiling and segmentation. When you look at different verticalsnow the biggest mistake that everybody that I see not everybody wants again alot of people make. is they try and go all in and develop a whole new teamwith that, whereas they could gradually jump up market pretty fast by earmarking some of their best reps, to invest? Maybe thirty out of seventypercent of their focus on those bigger companies and then continue to scale upand then once it hits a maturity point. You could have a whole dedicated teamaround that. But what about this sales motion? You know what is what do peopleassume is different about the...

...enterprise sales motion, like you know,same sort of thing like a lot of companies that are moving up marketright there us and be their mid market they're in a much more transactional,sale. They're not used to dealing with procurement they're not used to dealingwith INFOSEC and with all of the different compliance requirements. Whatdo you think is the mechanism to evolve your sales motion so that you can beeffective in replicating your top customers? That's a great question Sam.I mean when you're trying to do that. I think it's really really critical tofocus on vertical ization when you do that, and and what I mean by that isdon't boil the ocean a lot of times. What I see when I'm working withclients is they'll, say yeah, we work with all different verticales. Theymight have two hundred clients or three hundred clients or four hundred clients.However, sixty percent of the revenue comes from two verticals right, so goall in on that and expand on that and t be really targeted with that and then acouple of other things. Actually, probably the single biggest mistakethat I see people make time in and time out when it comes to the actualmechanics of it are when you're looking at basically quantifying the size ofthe problem- and I know that sounds simple, but people will go through andthey will sales executives will meet with people or Sayers leadership willmeet with people and they will basically identify. You know. Okay,this is a good candidate, but one of the things when they're doing that isthey basically forget to really really continue to expand. I'm kind of lost mytri train the thought here, Sam, so Oh yeah, I'm sorry quantify n the sideof problem. There you go, I'm back. I Blige O bring eity cured out your inwas like Frank. The tank when he gave a speech at old school year is like whathappened. I just blacked out and so they'll have these sales processes thatare a year two years long. Three Years Long,I saw one company had a thirty six month, sale cycle for a million dollardeal which is insane right and said that to be right six to to nine months,and so they don't tangibly quantify the outcome of the problem that they'retrying to solve and have that validated by the customer. That's the number onebiggest mistake and what I mean by that is like get the customer to assign atangible dollar value and a tangible time value to the problem you're goingto solve and have that validated up and down the chain. That's the biggestmistake, and your point is that they, if they do, do that, it's there they'reunder sizing or under scoping the impact, and so maybe that leads todelate or longer sale cycles, because the problem isn't perceived to beimportant enough. Well, it's just convoluted: it's not clarified. You know and I'll give an an example.This, like I, was working with a company the other day and it was asoftware company, software development,...

...cus company, custom softwaredevelopment and they basically create solutions for fortune. Five hundredcompanies really custom software, so they can implement it fast, and thisperson is amazing, amazing, at building relationships and connecting at anindividual level. However, one of the things that they were missing is thesolution might be two three hundred thousand dollars right and they gethammered by procurement on pricing. However, the reason for that is because,after the fact, once that we talked he went back and identified that thatsoftware solution that they created open up twenty to forty million dollarsand revenue based on a new product offering that they were creating now,if you just say hey, this is great, and this is going to grow revenue, that'scool, but if you say hey, this could potentially grow revenue by twenty toforty million based on projections that your team did, that totally disarms for Karamat interms of saying three hundred thousand dollars is too much right. Do you think it's too little? Inthat context? Three hundred thousand in the Oh yeah yeah, you should becharging way more. What's the rule of thumb on impact to price, in youropinion, yeah and there's there's two ways to look at this Sam. I think youcould look at ten x for impact. I mean that's what I try and do with mycustomers. If they invested, you know a thousand dollars. I want to give themat least ten zero dollars back for every dollar. You know, pollerecompanies have overhead as well, so you could look at revenue or you can lookat profit right at a ten profit, so that's kind of how I look at it eitherin terms of outcomes. What do you do to again? You know thinking about thismovement market, because it's just top of mine for so many different people beso they, whether it's nine months, whether it's three years or thirty, sixmonths, it's definitely longer than you know, a thirty or sixty day, mid marketsales cycle. So a company and a CEO and a sales team is moving from a periodwhere they get lots of discreet kind of like outcomes. They get a lot of databecause they are either winning the deal or losing the deal on a much moreaccelerated time frame, but in enterprise sales you don't actuallyknow whether you're winning or losing for quite a while. So how do you put ina system so that you can figure out that you're tracking towards winningthe deal? Even if that win is you know, six to nine months to twelve months inyour future? Yeah, it's a great question and it was so funny because,like when I first started and we were working and trying to build this motion.That was one of the things that came up because the CEO was like. We don't havethe results yet, and so I'm like okay. How am I going to convey to him why this is or how this is successfulso far, because I knew we were making progress right so, instead of justlooking at the overall outcome from a revenue perspective, we looked at milestones by deal stage right. So it was a...

...combination of the overall pipe sizeand then the goals in terms of what we were getting. So I guess to answer aquestion more specifically: that's on the internal side, when you look at itexternally from a customer. There's certain bench marks that you have thatyou need them to hit at each stage in the cycle and that's that needs to betracked from a qualitative and quantitative perspective, veryspecifically to validate that. It's a good opportunity, because, SAM, ifyou're, working, big opportunities, reps ill die in the vine, if they'renot qualifying I'm hard enough because they could just suck the life and timeout of it right yeah. So I would say it's speed by step in the sales cycleand different bench marks by stage, and I could go deeper on that. If you wantto sure a little deeper they'll be super helpful because I know people arelistening are probably taking some notes. So, what's a good example and bythe way, how many stages is your does it? Maybe people would assume out therethat, like Oh, if it's a twelve month sale cycle, that means we have to have.You know fifteen stages instead of four but my experiences, you can still havefour stages, even if they each take a longer time. What do you think yeah soin terms of stages and that I could hit on that first point of what you wouldyou ask but like if you look at stages, I think you know obviously there's theinitial median the first appointment and I think that needs to be qualifiedwith first appointment with a decision maker or if you're selling, to acompany. That's like fifteen billion, a revenue or three billion and revenue.The key key person like the highest person within reason that you can getto because you're not always going to get to the CIO of a three billiondollar company right when you, when you're selling a deal depending on thedeal size. So first appointment. I think, then, you go through what I callit could be a demo if it's a a solution, but I think before the Demo, one of themost critical pieces is an assessment to really quantify that hard value, Roioutcome and then from there you can incorporate a demo, because then youroide a customize demo, then the the fourth stage would be what I call astrategy meeting so that strategy, meaning is validation of outcomes aswell as opportunities with potential Roy more like a high level. Basically Pencil sell on what you'redoing and get verbal confirmation that the solution you put together isdesigned appropriately and then the next is proposal stage, negotiation,clothes, so a few more stages than kind of what you talked about, but that'skind of how I look at it. Yeah makes sense. Let me ask you a question. Youknow you sort of said. I work with a lot of companies and I try to teachthem that they don't need funding, walk us through that process and what is itthat you have something against funding or you know just give us yourperspective on t on the market right now, because right now, it's flush withcapital, everybody's raising money, everybody's getting acquired, I've,never seen so much. You know activity... the space that we're both in. Sowhat's your perspective on financing, and how do you help companies get therewithout having to sell equity? It's a great question, Sam and in why? I focus on that or I think it's anopportunity because kind of the way I look at it is a lot of the founders arefocused on getting funding and getting ready forfunding before they've, even completely established success. And you know when you look at thenumbers, it's pretty disturbing and some of this data needs to be updated,but this is taken from tech crunch earlier. I think it was up to twothousand and ten. So it's definitely earlier data, but basically seed series,a right there or seed. I should say basically has a failure exit at ninetyseven percent of the time, and I was just like once I saw that I'm like, Oh,my God, ninety seven percent failure to exit right and then you look at itseries a and they're failure to exits, like almost eighty nine percent, and soyou know why I I've been through the other side of the table where I've beenin through multiple private equity transactions and when I've seen theinvestors come in. I've been an equity partner and it's been cool. However,it's massively changed the companies that I work for and multiple ways likesales cop is gotten destroyed and basically the culture I've seen itdestroyed a multiple times. So that's been my experience and then to top itoff, I talked to actually did a podcast about this. I talked to a CEO who wentthrough a three hundred million dollar exit through V C, and he told me thestory of the financial engineering that gets put together so that there's nodownside for the investors, but there's a lot of downside for the CEO and so what happened Sam and this waslike really eye opening t is basically, he told me that basically, they had tenmillion dollars that they put in that that BC fun put in. They got ninetymillion from other investors. They bought the company for a hundredmillion right. They grew up to close to a three hundred million dollar numberexited, and what happened? is they made that spread off of a ten million dollarrisk? Now, on top of that, they got fifty percent interest every year andthe founder who started the company got fired and they threw a party becausethe CEO, that was there lasted three years, and that was the longest any CEOever lasted. So I heard this and I'm like okay, I just want to give folksanother option that and like I said, there's cases where funny works outgreat right, but I want to give people another option to exist so that theycould turn one dollar and a ten dollar without needing to get money from otherpeople to do that and obviously a yeah it does, and obviously the other optionis getting funding from your customers... selling them products instead ofequity. Exactly you just you get caseful from your customers or you cando crowd fundy or there's just so many other options, but, like I'm tellingyou, Sam the markets, brainwashed from people I hear is like we got to getfundy, we got to get fun, I'm like why I'm like you can't turn one dollar anda ten dollars how you going to turn a million in a ten million. It's a goodquestion. You know what I mean man, it's justlike what not like it's different like now. Now grant there's reasons forfunding when, in my opinion, right when you start to grow and you got, you gota good revenue and you're like all right, we're going to pour gas on thisright. There's a lot of invisible UNICORNS is what they call that havegotten funding later by doing that, and that's a great model as well. However,it's more for the early stage folks are like this is the only option I have andthen they convert and they have a boss when the whole reason why they starteda business was to not have a boss right. They wanted to be their own boss, andnow they got a answer to investors and then they get fired half the time. It'sjust this is mind. Bending to me yeah I mean I hear you I I didn't want a boss.Now I have a bus, but nobody should worry that you know thestory that you just shared is not is not what's going to be happening withwith my company. Well it to it I mean Sam's a little different because, likeyou, grew the RC up to a very healthy level. You know it was sustainedorganic growth that you did. I'm talking like people early stay justthrowing money out of the problem and expecting it to solve everything sototally different situation. Yeah, no you're right, but to the point you alsojust got a terms are real liquidation preferences are real. You know, and investors are at their job, is to makemoney so yeah yeah, that's true that their whole purpose is like. How can weprotect? You know when you look at it, comparing venture capital to privateequity to any up to a loan from a bank I mean all of the shitty stuff notwithstanding. Venture capital still is the most generous, for I mean to thepoint right, they're, like people writing checks to people with nocompanies. So you know that's a pretty optimistic thing to do to what to write.You know a first time founder. A million dollar check when you knowthere might not even be a product in place. Yeah Rigaer, almost at the end of our timetogether. One thing I want to to ask you, though, you've got this phrasethat you know we were talking before you have this concept of perfectcustomer prosperity. Tell me what you mean by that. I, like that phrase, YeahMat, so what I see is a massive opportunity is company is alwaysworried. A lot of companies are worried and I can a stop speaking of generality.So you could you could slap me when we get off the it's okay, I mean you're a little overly concerned likeno. Nobody assumes that you're speaking for all mankind. You know we understand.We can place your opinions in context, but I hear you yeah so perfect customerprosperity, man, I mean what that's focused on an that goes deeper intowhale scaling where companies will have strategic focus on expanding theirrevenue. However, it goes back to the twenty rule, to the point where I evenhave a Mug that says eight twenty on it,...

...there's not a design strategy, most ofthe time to accelerate the quantity and size of the customers that produce.Eighty percent of the revenue I mean Sam I've ever seen if it's justabsolutely crazy and I'm like like that's how we grew the company so fastwith only four sales Rup, and we got the thirty million and an racin revenuein five and a half years with people that never sold before, and it was justbe. You know not just because of the there's a lot of other reasons, but we had no marking. We had no SDRs, wehad, I mean dude, our processes were like popsicle sticks and duct tape. Itwas terrible, and so the big reason, though, is we kept leveling up thosetop five customers so year one we had twenty sand dollars a month in anierinrevenue. Those were a kind of the area we played in then we bumped it up toseventy five tousand dollars a month. Then it was a hundred and fifty. Then Igot the three hundred. Then it got to six hundred thousand, and I that that'skind of what, where I think everybody focuses an I cp and I believe CP is theway to go because, instead of just looking at all your prospects, the sameyou look at the hyper, valuable ones and have your focus in your energy andyour team really lasers, laser scoped on thoseand everything that they need and that's what'll, create in saying growthand there's a company. If you heard of Palante before, of course, I've heardof pound here all right. So there was, I think I sawthe one point, one billion in revenue, yeah they're man, and I saw something that Jason Lunkin put outon it. He did like a quick run down on from Saster who did a quick run down ofthat and one of the things that he said and his piece was that sixty six percent of Palante's onebillion dollars in revenue was from twenty clients and one of the lie.Clients is the government of the United States of America. Let that sink inlike and then the other thing that was beautiful about this. Sam Is that thesize that those those top customers were growing was it like thirty, threepercent per year, so their biggest customers, Yep just kept counou Dinggrowth and sales force is doing a lot on this even service now as as well,but they're leveraging their biggest customers and they're, not just gettingthose big customers, they keep expanding those big customers year anda year out, and so that's why I think it's a beautiful strategy that youcould do even when your resource constrained as lot as you just have thefocus, energy and time on it. Well, it's a powerful insight, because you'reright, everybody's so focused on new logo acquisition that sometimes youforget to tend to the people that you've already acquired, make sure thatthey're happy and see. If you can expand the relationship. There's sevenx, cheaper man, you know what I mean it's seven times cheaper to get anexisting customer to spend more with you and that's where they like thewhole secondary sales system, our secondary sales operating system. Italk about people like this is a big mistake too, and I know you're gonnayou're going to get me. The Old Hook like they have on the stage like theold school hook, because I'm rambling,...

...but I want to squeeze up I'm not. Iplay I'm going to play the music that they play at the operation. Yeah, therapid up box, like a Dave Chipel, so anyways dude forget, like companieswill have it. Ninety percent ninety percent retention rate- and these willbe forty thousand a D. fifty hundred thousand dollar deals right and theydon't freaking talk to their customers after they sell it to them. Thesecustomers say and I'm like do you know how many referrals you could systemizedby doing that? Like do you know how much remedy you can expand if you justdropped an existing process like a second sales process on your existingcustomers and oh by the way, it's going to increased satisfaction, oh by theway you're going to get more ratings, Ng to and Oh by the way, you're goingto continually expand and get product development feedback on what works andwhat doesn't? So I'm really passionate about, as you could tell, but it's likeyou know, there's low hanging, fruit and then there's fruit down the groundand that's what I consider fruit on the ground. I love it, but that's interesting. Wegot to pick up the fruit on the ground or rots yeah man exactly you nailed itthere. You go all right Ryan. The last thing we want to do is hear about someof your influences: people, books, investors, CEOS people that you thinkwe should know about if you're taste, with the responsibility of paying itforward and letting us know about people that had a positive impact onyour life in any form and you don't have to have met them, they could be.You now could be Tom, hanks or whatever who comes to mind yeah. So GreatQuestions Sam, I love growth man, it's one of my core human needs and I valueit and once it flip me on it's change in my life, so I love the fact that youask that question. So a great great book that I read. If you really want tocompletely transform your thinking and this book has been recommended bymultiple billionaires, it's only thirty six pages and it's called you squared,have you ever heard of it or read it before? No, I haven't yeah, it's onlythirty six pages and a mentor of mind gentleman, my name of myrand golden heactually sold. He. He sold three million dollars in a sixty minutespeech before so really really awesome and he recommended that it's a book youread weekly and so I've read that Book Multiple Times only thirty six pages,and it really gets you to stop and think so you square it. Why Al You orthe? No? Ah, why you square great? And it's it's a really really really greatbook. That's super simple awesome, but really impactful like you just got tostop and let the stuff sink in though so that's one, I think it's by pricePritchett. I believe his name is so that that's someone who I have a lot ofrespect for and then you know man like one of my deepest darkest points, andthis is when things were tough in different stages of my career, a mentorof mine who another mentor mind basically said: Hey Dude, you shouldcheck out this personal development a...

...event and I'm like. I don't even knowwhat personal development was Sam. I mean this is like six years ago I waslike what the hell person of the bell an what. What are you talking aboutlike a conference right, and so that was Tony Robins, and I thought Ithink his stuff is very, very insightful for that yeah and thensomeone I respect when you look at from a business, the founder that has bootsdrapped to he bootstrap from zero to a hundred million with click finals andthat's Russell Brunson and he's built like a cult like fowling, so justreally different people that are unique, that I've gotten a lot of value fromover the years that seem to give first and take that it, and I love thatawesome. Bryan, it's been great having you on the show. If folks want to getin touch with you, what's the best way, how can they get in touch with you? Yes,the best way SAM is, I actually put together a special resource. They couldcontact me on. You know: Ryan, Staley, dot, io. Of course, I'm active onLinkedin and other things as well. That's my website. That's got differentcontent. However, I got a resource that aligns well with kind of what we talkedabout and basically it's the top ten questions needed to unlock anyenterprise deal so I'll share that it's just a free resource. It's at www dot,sm built freedom forward pod, it's www, sm built freedom, com, Ford, pod, and I give thatresource to people. Listen to my podcast. The sales and marking builtfreedom podcast as well so free resource could help you. It was takendirectly from Fortune One hundred fortune, five thousand, I'm sorry, fourto one hundred fortune, five hundred executives on their exact criteria thatthey use to evaluate people when they're trying to sell them anenterprise deal fantastic Ryan thanks. So much for being on the show and we'lltalk. Jon Friday for Friday fundamentals, Awesome Sam, lookingforward to it, everybody at Sam's Corner GreatConversation with Ryan, a couple things just to point out. First of all,everybody wants to move up market, but as Ryan plant it out when you do it,the number one problem he said is that you're not framing the economic impactof that. Your solution to your buyer aggressively enough and you're notgetting them to agree to that number and confirm it and up and down thechain, the power line and all the people that you're talking to and, ofcourse, the sales process hammering and anchoring on that number. And if youdon't do that, if you don't size the problem, then your solution can bestalled. It can be chucked aside because it can't be a priority if theydon't understand the economic impact. So make sure that you do that. Theother thing that Ryan talked about is just that too many companies don'tvertical ze they spray and pray. You know enterprise means any company overa thousand employees and boom they're off to the racist there's. There arethousands and thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, if not millions,of companies that have more than a thousand or ten thousand employees. Soit's not a very useful focusing mechanism. Instead, try to pick yoursegment look at who your best customer... and Ryan said: It's not just thecompany that pays you the most it's the company that is also the mostprofitable, because you could have a company that pays you the most and it'sjust a huge pain in the ass, and you know every day, they're hammer and helpdesk or filling out the ticket or calling somebody and just being reallyreally difficult to work with. So it's not just the company that pays. You Mus,it's probably going to be the company that pays you the most, but also thecompany. That is also a great customer and then try to mimic and replicatethat and try to do it slowly. You don't have to hire fifty people and build anenterprise sales motion in one fell swoop. You can do it over time andgradually still quickly, but gradually and organically, by understanding yourexisting customers and then mimicking that and going forward from there- andyou know Brian's point- is try to do that: Try to fund your business throughto revenue as opposed to selling equity or debt in your business, because onceyou do that you have owners and you have bosses and you need to report andit can contort the dynamics of the business. So you know not: Everycompany needs to raise money right away, especially at the sea stage. There areother paths to creating a great company. You Know My company Pavilion. We didn'traise money for five years. We finally raised a round and closed it. In Aprilwe raised a twenty five million dollar round, but before that we'd beenprofitable, we had a team, thirty five people, all of it funded from ourmembers and our members being happy with the experience that we deliveredand, as a consequence, that's how we funded the business. So there are otherpaths to financing Your Business and financing. Your growth and Ryan's pointis may be considered an our price sales as one path, but you don't have to boilthe ocean go after in segments and sequences so that you can do itlogically over time. So good conversation, if you're not a part ofthe sales tacker community, yet you're missing out any sales professionalconjoin as a member to ask questions, get immediate answers and sureexperiences with like minded B to be sales pros, jumping and starteddiscussion with more than seventeen thousand sales professionals at saleshacker com. Once again, thanks to our sponsors outreach, the world's leadingsales engage on platform had to outreach out io for slash on out reachto see how outrage does outreach, we're also sponsored by pavilion leaders atevery stage, can get started at Joint Pavilion Com to unlock yourprofessional potential and were sponsored by ambition. Every salesleader feels the pressure to predictably close. More deals. Takecontrol with ambition, cod ambition, com for lash sales, hacker there's afew other things, I'm supposed to say, I'm supposed to say, give us five stars.I will just worry that that ship is sailed. I think were four point: Fivesomebody gave US force, but you know if you could give us a five, we toappreciate it, and if you want to get in touch with me, of course you canemail me salmon, join pavillion Com, I'm happy to help, you need any you nedor anything you just. Let me know otherwise I'll talk to you next time. I.

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